What Originality by Tony Paul and the Detroit News!
by Ian Casselberry on Dec 3, 2009 12:55 PM EST
in News
15 comments
Isn't it interesting that the Detroit News is featuring a multi-part series on Dave Dombrowski today? Days before the Winter Meetings, something like that makes sense. Get a feel for what moves the Tigers' GM might make, based on past transactions, the signings and trades that worked and didn't work, and the decisions he's paying for now.
Yet it all seems so familiar. Hmm, I can't quite place it. Oh, wait - yes, I can.
All week long, beginning on Monday, Kurt Mensching and Mack Avenue Tigers has been running an in-depth series on Dombrowski. What is his philosophy as a GM? What moves has he made during his tenure in Detroit? What approach has he taken to trades and what results have those transactions yielded? How has he developed the team's minor league system? And how has he dealt with the free agent market?
Coincidence? Or hackery by the Detroit News sports department?
Am I accusing the News of copying Mack Avenue Tigers? Well, no - Kurt's series is actually a hell of a lot better. If you don't want to take the time to read Kurt's thoughtful and meticulous analysis, perhaps you'd prefer Tony Paul's Cliff Notes version. And the News' feature has photos at its disposal.
Maybe it's all in the timing. After all, the Winter Meetings are next week, and that's when Dombrowski's job as a general manager tends to receive the most attention. I'm sure that's it. And Paul probably decided to do such a series, instead of Lynn Henning, the guy who's written everything about the Tigers this offseason for the News.
Perhaps this is a coincidence worth mentioning to the Detroit News' sports editor, Ruben Luna, or his deputy editor, Phil Laciura, via e-mail. Maybe the News' editor and publisher, Jonathan Wolman, should be apprised of this, as well.
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I had read Kurt's series and found it thoughtful and well written.
So, when I saw this post I headed over to detnews.com to read Paul’s columns.
Oh sweet Jeebus in the Manger, it’s like apples and carp poison. Kurt was first and infinitely better. Hmmm….I may have to write a little something in the “Comments” over at the News.
Read Kurt's DD stuff
Noticed the News’ last night with the exhaustive list of DD’s moves and wondered if they got the idea from Kurt’s notable, less but more in depth, moves posts. Both interested me, but Kurt’s was obviously more thought provoking.
Not much to cover with the Tigers these days and it’s no secret DD is under the most scrutiny going into Winter Meetings, especially with his deadline fails & and all the bad contracts. I think the posts are fairly different (with Kurt’s being MUCH better). I’d say it might be worth mentioning to the News editors, just to make sure they didn’t hijack the idea. If they got the idea to run multiple posts on DD from Kurt I don’t have a problem with them doing it, as much as I do with them not crediting him at the beginning of each piece. If I were Kurt, though, I’d be very appreciative of you lookin’ out, Ian.
Motown String Music- SB Nation's Detroit Pistons Blog
I saw these detnews articles this morning
and wondered if Kurt maybe had contributed his stuff to them – which obviously isn’t the case! WTF.
I think this is all overblown...
so once someone writes their thoughts on paper, thoughts that many others have by the way, it’s theirs forever?
Perhaps he did lift the idea from Kurt, and this is really not a shot at Kurt or you Ian… it’s just…
When do newspapers or reporters catch a break for writing about stuff that a blogger may have written a day earlier?
As far as the Tigers are concerned this offseason, everyone has a solid idea what the status of the team is.. cut expendable salaries and utilize in house talent or acquire prospects who are major league ready.
Am I going to get mad if a dumbass like Drew Sharp writes about that same line of thought tomorrow? No, not at all.
It’s not worth emailing anyone’s editor because we may be just as intelligent as the editor who assigned the reporter to the story. Who are we, as independent bloggers, to say “OMG YOU DIDNT CREDIT ME” when we utilizes AP photos or forms opinions from AP articles or ESPN segments and don’t “credit” them?
I dont think the Detroit News owes Kurt anything. It’s not like his idea is all that original anyway. “What’s DD’s philosophy?”, wow you can go back to the years as Marlins Pres and perhaps find columns about that. Did Kurt credit those columns? When does the sniping by bloggers to the media end? It’s not blatant, it’s coincidental at a time where all baseball beat writers should be writing about the upcoming winter meetings and really that’s all there is to write about…
You're missing something.
It’s not like Kurt wrote an analysis of Cabrera immediately after he had a slumping month. That sort of story is obvious and many people writing about it happens all the time. A sudden influx of in-depth articles on the GM of the Tigers? Not so obvious.
We haven’t exactly heard Kurt’s line on this, but at the very least it’s making a whole slew of us pause this morning/afternoon and go “huh… weird”.
2100 Woodward and Twitter
No, I don't think Im missing anything...
This isn’t about the content so much as it’s the overreaction. What else is there to write about? A Brandon Inge trade rumor? More made up trade rumorsfrom the sports media and bloggers?
I like Ian a lot, but I believe this was a complete overreaction and am not surprised that the writer AND Kurt both had similar ideas because, again, what else is there to say?
I don’t believe giving Kurt credit is necessary in this case, no matter how credit Kurt gave sites in his pieces.
That’s not a knock on Kurt, it’s just honesty. I hope Kurt and Ian continue the high quality posts rather than take time to bash a sportswriter who was told what to do by a boss.
by Boney on Dec 3, 2009 8:46 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
See Ian's post.
Everything’s clear now, zero reason to drag this thread out.
2100 Woodward and Twitter
by john.kmiecik on Dec 3, 2009 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
Not crediting an article that may have helped shaped an opinion that was already developing is completely different from stealing an entire idea, which, here, is dealing with a series of posts on DD. It’s one thing if they just did a post on DD, but they did a series of posts, all too familiar to what Kurt did a couple days before.
I agree with you that it may be overblown and I don’t know if needed an entire post like this calling the Detroit News out, but I think it definitely deserves a note to the editor just to make sure the idea wasn’t completely taken from Kurt.
I think, in general, blogs are pretty good in crediting the major things (pictures, major ideas for posts, linking, etc.) when it’s clear they got them elsewhere. I agree it’d be ridiculous to say no one is allowed to write about DD and his philosophies just because Kurt wrote about it first, but the News didn’t just write a DD article, they put out like 4 in one day, all about him and his philosophies, just days after Kurt. It’s fair to wonder if they jacked the idea. If they did, Kurt deserves some credit. A DD post in and of itself is not original, but the series of posts coming out over a matter of days is.
Motown String Music- SB Nation's Detroit Pistons Blog
I might be defensive about it
Maybe it truly is a coincidence of timing. We’ll never know.
But it bothers me when bloggers get knocked for swiping material from the media, and then something like this happens. Reporters and bloggers come up with similar ideas all the time, but I feel I frequently make an effort to make sure credit is given where it’s due, and would like to be shown the same courtesy.
I don’t expect everyone to agree with this. And maybe this is just more of a concern among bloggers. But what I hope is that a guy doesn’t think that just because he writes for the Detroit News (as a blogger, by the way, not a reporter), he shouldn’t extend a professional courtesy that he would likely show to a colleague in the media.
by Ian Casselberry on Dec 3, 2009 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
I completely skipped the DetNews columns in my reader.
Without even looking I knew Kurt’s would be better written. It did make me pause. I’m curious if Kurt has a line on this.
2100 Woodward and Twitter
My line on this (Honestly, I wasn't planning on having one)
Like I’ve said in the past. I am not a newbie to the newspaper business. It was my career. And during that career, I’ve watched as the Detroit Free Press blatantly stole a story that I wrote for my newspaper, including using details that they only could have gotten by being boots on the ground up here. I’ve written as a correspondent for the News, too, and would not do so again based on that experience.
As a blogger, I am used to seeing ideas fellow bloggers or myself write be put forward in the media. I generally just shrug it off. I’ve seen my analysis inspired interview questions, notebook pieces, etc. Sure it would be nice of journalists cited blogs for unique content, but we’ve seen they’re not very good at citing other journalists, so it’s no surprise. I’m never offended by it and I take no sides in the Internet vs. Traditional Media fight, because I’ve been on both sides of the great divide.
I am more or less just doing that now. I knew when I started the series it would end up in the media in some form or other. So I wasn’t surprised when it did. Surprised it was a bit blatant, sure. But not surprised. I did not write the series to be exclusive content, I wrote the series to be informative. And I hope I succeeded on that mark. Mr. Paul did have a lot of similar items but he at least sought ways to differentiate himself by looking in other directions.
It would go a long way if the media would just acknowledge its sources better. I cited several places up front that went into my research. Three fellow blogs, Baseball-Reference, Fangraphs, Scout.com’s Tigers coverage, ESPN.com and Cot’s Baseball Contracts. The News cited how many sources for all their transactions, stats and figures?
People can come to their own conclusions as to what they think. I appreciate all the support readers have given the series.
I enjoyed Kurts...
I’m not sure if I’m gonna bother with the News.
My Music: Some Sorta Giant
My Blog: Inside A Head
hmm
This would have been a lot less funny if Kurt’s had been so much better. Since it clearly was, this is just hilarious. You keep chasin’ that carrot, DetNews!
by Roar of the Tigers on Dec 3, 2009 7:46 PM EST reply actions
should be a 'hadn't' in there
ah don’t type 2 gud
by Roar of the Tigers on Dec 3, 2009 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
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