Off-Day/Trade Deadline Open Thread
by Ian Casselberry on Jul 30, 2009 2:10 PM EDT
in Detroit Tigers News
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PrintOkay, at this point, the smart thing to do is probably just post an open thread as kind of a catch-all while we all wait to see if the Tigers are going to make a move on their off-day.
We just saw how itchy people's trigger fingers were on Twitter, where news of Josh Willingham being pulled from the Nationals lineup sent up a surge in speculation. Minutes later, however, it was learned that Willingham was sitting down due to a sore neck (and would even be available to pinch-hit), and not because he was being traded.
Meanwhile, if you didn't know, the Tigers did indeed make a trade, just not the sort we're hoping for. Josh Anderson's blaze out of a Tigers career officially ended with him being traded to the Royals for cash. Maybe that's how the team plans to give out those $300 food credits on party suites.
Of course, if anyone wants to BYOBYB, feel free.
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too much time
browsing the web for info, like me?
Welcome to Detroit>>Where the weak are killed and eaten.
Willingham...
…was pulled from the Nats lineup today….Maybe???
by BennieBladesFan on Jul 30, 2009 2:21 PM EDT reply actions
Well
they said it was because he had a stiff neck, but we all know how they lie.
Welcome to Detroit>>Where the weak are killed and eaten.
stiff neck
is what they are saying. Not because of a trade. Well, we’ll see.
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
Does being traded for cash have to be the most disheartening thing ever?
You can’t even judge yourself against the player you are getting traded for.
I realize it is a lot like free agency but I just think it would suck to get traded for cash.
I root for the Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings and yes, the Lions.
www.twitter.com/zajareich
or getting traded.....
….for baseballs and bats….Happens in the minors
by BennieBladesFan on Jul 30, 2009 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree
Poor Josh, just another whore of major league baseball.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 30, 2009 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Just in case anyone's wondering why the Tigers won't get Roy Halladay
After inquiring about the asking price for Blue Jays right-hander Roy Halladay, the Tigers bowed out ahead of Friday’s trade deadline when they were told Toronto wanted pitchers Rick Porcello, Ryan Perry and Casey Crosby, an elite prospect.
This probably deserves its own post, but since the open thread just opened…
by Ian Casselberry on Jul 30, 2009 2:30 PM EDT reply actions
Interesting
If this is accuarate I wonder what people’s opinions on it are. I am probably more comfortable than most in trading Porcello and Crosby seems to be our “untouchable” prospect. I actually only hesitate with Perry involved. He isn’t great yet but he fills a need in the bullpen and I don’t know he have to replace him. Granted he is neither a closer or 8th inning guy (yet) but I am comfortable with him coming in in the 6th or 7th and either keeping us in a game or helping us hold a lead. I am surprised someone like a Cale Iorg is not mentioned since I remember hearing when the Halladay rumors started that they would be looking for a SS prospect. If the Tigers traded for Halladay it would be the equivalent of going all in. Halladay is clearly an improvement in the rotation over Porcello (atleast for now) and Crosby is not going to contribute. But losing Perry creates a hole in the bullpen and makes the deal a bad deal if your looking to win now. Just one mans opinion. As it is, I would rather use Crosby and another prospect to add a bat and hold on to Porcello and Perry.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
For just those three
it is very tempting and while I don’t think losing Perry creates a huge hole in the pen, we would have to replace him with someone. When you trade for someone like Halladay you better be sure you can win and if we give up Perry we create a hole that needs to be filled. I do like your spirit on this though. I am not a play for the future guy but I am not sure I would take the above proposed deal.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Not me
I have a feeling we have something very special in Porcello, and Perry/Crosby have a very good chance to be great as well. Not worth the risk IMO.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the risk is
that if you get Halladay and don’t win a title it probably wasn’t worth it. Porcello as a rookie is establishing himself as a quality starter and all indications are that he will only get better. Perry has also shown promise in the bullpen and could be the closer in a few years. These guys are rookies but in my opinion they have done enough in the majors to validate their status as top prospects. To lose them for Halladay and not win a title would be a bad move in my opinion.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions
true
It’s different if the prospect in question is one who hasn’t shown any ability at the major league level yet. Porcello and Perry have shown enough that they might be very good players – and the might be very good players soon, instead of “they might be in the majors in three or four years.”
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I'd like to know what DD is waiting for?
sure, we all know porcello is gonna be good. But can you imagine facing a rotation of Halladay, Verlander, and Jackson in the playoffs? Suddenly it doesn’t matter who our 4th and 5th starters are. I just don’t see how a rotation like that would ever lose a playoff series. I firmly believe that winning a world series is about catching lighting in a bottle, and that certainly takes a little luck. Porcello, Perry, and Crosby all show a good deal of promise, but Halladay, Verlander, and Jackson are 3 of the top 10 pitchers in the game RIGHT NOW! Maybe I’m too greedy, but I would have never passed this up. My guess is, we can’t afford Porcello, and let him go in a couple of years anyway. I just don’t know what DD is waiting for? Guillen, Maggs, and Thames to get their youth back?
How many of our prospects actually end up being quality big leaguers anyways?
Verlander and Granderson. Can you think of any more as of recently? I sure can’t.
Traded for cash
Wasn’t Babe Ruth traded for cash? I think it used to a lot more common than it is today.
Curious to know how much a player like Anderson would go for, but of course they never reveal the amount of cash involved.
from wikipedia
In the January 6, 1920 edition of The Boston Globe, Frazee described the transaction:
“I should have preferred to take players in exchange for Ruth, but no club could have given me the equivalent in men without wrecking itself, and so the deal had to be made on a cash basis. No other club could afford to give me the amount the Yankees have paid for him, and I don’t mind saying I think they are taking a gamble. With this money the Boston club can now go into the market and buy other players and have a stronger and better team in all respects than we would have had if Ruth had remained with us.”
$100,000 cash plus lots of loans
Anderson sure isn’t any Ruth :)
Ruth for cash
Nice historical nugget there. If Ruth = $100,000 in 1920s money (which is like the GDP of China or Bill Gates’ checking account today) Josh Anderson = $50 and a box of second-hand fungo bats.
I would hardly
compare Josh Andrerson to Babe Ruth
Welcome to Detroit>>Where the weak are killed and eaten.
Fenway Park opened in 1912 (same as Tiger Stadium)
So unless the Ruthian cash was used to add a second deck or whatever, that’s not accurate
Official BYB Juju Consultant...now accepting rally creature applications!
And the other trivia question answered
It was so the Sox owner could open his show, “No No Nanette”
I root for the Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings and yes, the Lions.
www.twitter.com/zajareich
Lynn Henning
Off the Wall rant I must get off my chest.
I know I’m late on this cuz I don’t live in Detroit so I don’t get the Free Press but what the hell is wrong with Lynn Henning? Did he really say that Grandy is running out of rope and time to be our spark plug? I know he OBP is down but his glove has gone back to being top notch, his power is obviously peaking and his Stolen Bases are up and would be higher if Leyland didn’t enjoy seeing Polly GIDP so much. The only thing Grandy is having trouble with is finding the gaps. His BABIP is down from previous years. Not to mention he is everything you could ask for as a representative of the team. Why are writer’s allowed to write such stupid things. I know I shouldn’t get worked up but that is just the kind of nonsense and bad attitude that pisses me off. Look at Alan Trammell’s stats in 81’ and 82, we probably should have traded him too.
by dtowntigers4life on Jul 30, 2009 2:33 PM EDT reply actions
Henning is a hack
I can tell that because I’ve read two of his articles and they’ve both sucked.
That is the example of the logic that he’s using with both Miggy and Curtis’s numbers.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Come on do something
We really need to do something to improve this team. I think we are good but we need to add a bat and some bullpen help.
"Sometimes life deals you lemons, I say make lemonade with them."
This cant be it ...
It just cant be. DD has to be in the tense moments of some epic staredown … just waiting to make the call and get something done. Although I could easily see him watching last nights game and thinking that it was a sign from god … 13 runs? Our offense is fine. Lets just get some cash for Anderson and everyone goes to six flags on the way to Cleveland.
Cedar Point
Is much better than Six Flags, with way more roller-coasters than Fernando Rodney. And the whole team could benefit from riding the Mean Streak.
Cedar Point is awesome!
But I dont think they got enough money for Anderson to do a Cedar Point adventure. Certainly not be able to get into Soak City. The team would have to watch all the other people having fun on the water slides and it would depress them and all of a sudden we have three guys sitting tomorrows game out due to heat exhaustion.
Our team's big day out at Cedar Point
Soak City rules!
But I can totally see Inge and Verlander wasting all of their per diem on those games where you try to win stuffed animals from carnies (they both seem like the ultra-competitive type) while Miggy, Maggs and Guillen wander around all day in search of the Venezuela area, only to realize that they aren’t at Epcot Center. Meanwhile, Leyland is kicked out for not only smoking, but giving cigarettes to kids, and Zumaya can’t resist the temptation of Guitar Hero in the park’s arcade and somehow manages to paralyze himself from the neck down. Rodney, of course, spends the day riding the Magnum XL200 and Millennium Force, thinking, “There’s something really familiar about this sensation.” Elsewhere, Curtis Granderson wanders into a bachelor auction and ends up enriching the coffers of the Sandusky, Ohio, knitting club by a cool $50,000.
Somehow, a head count goes wrong at the end of the day and the bus leaves without Nate Robertson and Dontrelle Willis.
+100
This is great.
And something tells me that botched head count would be not quite accidental…
by kendra.michelle on Jul 30, 2009 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
that sounds about right.
Show up next year and six former tigers are working the Snake River Falls ride and they have a cold glazed-over look in thier eyes. “Hey … Hey … I know you! Your Brandon Inge! What the hell happened?”
" I dont run no more. I get money from the park now. Its fun"
“Jesus, Brandon what did they do to you?”
“The man come down and fill me with french fries.”
That night on the news. “A local man was seen fleeing the scene of what authorities are calling an old fashioned arson at the amusement park. Witness said he was running with 4 men shouting about how this will not stand and the world series. Details as they come in.”
Snake River Falls FTW
Oh I just laughed so hard. Thank you.
Id love Rios!!!!
Hes a young that a change of scenery wuld do good
by BennieBladesFan on Jul 30, 2009 3:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Rios
As a Tiger fan living in Toronto, I could get behind that. He has a lot of upside. Too bad he has an awful contract that the Tigers would never take on after being so badly burned over the past few years.
Not that bad...
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/rios-wells
I keep saying it- Rios and Scott Rolen for Magglio Ordonez and either Cale Iorg or Wilkin Ramirez.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I like the bad contract for a bad contract
aspect but do you think either Cale Iorg or Wilkin Ramirez is enough for Scott Rolen? If so I would be very happy with this deal.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Rolen is costing 15 mil
Take some/most of that.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:11 PM EDT up reply actions
We could swoop in now
Take more money than the Reds are…
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Rolen to the Reds
still strikes me as a stupid move. Call me a snob, but I hate seeing teams who are out of it make stupid moves to add veterans when they should be preparing for next season.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Unless
the Reds have some interest in Maggs.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions
I did not realize
Rolen was making that much. Is he signed through the end of this year?
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Is he making 15 million next year?
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes (4m bonus)
So they pay the bonus and we take his salary. Problem solved.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions
What do we do with Inge?
and is Rolen still a fantastic defender?
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions
5 runs above average
According to Fangraphs. And we move one of them to corner OF when Ingey comes back.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I should have asked this sooner
but is this just your own idea or have you seen it somewhere else? I have to ask since I starting to get overly excited about the prospect of a deal like this. Hell, I wouldn’t have a problem doing Maggs, Iorg and Crosby for Rios and Rolen. Rios is young and makes roughly 10 million per through 2014 which is bad but not 18 million bad. Rolen’s offensive numbers with the Jays are great and if he can still play third that’s even better. Inge is a great athelete who can play LF full time until his contract is done. Clete can fill in in the outfield and Rios is solid started in RF. We would actually improve defensively some and we would make huge improvements offensively.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions
My idea alas
I have heard both Rios and Rolen being discussed as trade chips, and the Jays seem to want to deal away Rios as a salary dump.
Also, NEVER TRADE CASEY CROSBY. Don’t even talk about it.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
To each his own
I am not a prospect guy so until they have shown there stuff on a big league level I would never rule a guy as off-limits. If Crosby can help us land 2 guys that will make us better this year and next then I am fine seeing him go and dealing with it even if he becomes another John Smoltz.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm a bit of a Crosby fanboy
He’s our only legitimate blue-chipper at this point, so I’ve developed a bit of a man-crush.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
That's sounds a lot like how I felt about Porcello
esspecially when I had to watch White Soxes fans run their mouths about how bad the Tigers were and all I could do is say just wait to Porcello joins the rotation!
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
If it were up to me...
I’d keep Inge at third. He’s younger than Rolen and less injury-prone (this year’s bad knees notwithstanding).
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Fine by me
I don’t doubt that Rolen is a smart enough player to make the move to the outfield I just favored moving Inge because he has played more outfield and is such a good athelete that I think the transition would be smoother. Either way, I would love to have such problems as trying to decide between playing Rolen or Inge at third.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Craptastic
I need to learn to research better- Cards are paying that 11mm salary bonus.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
True
Not so much the amount as it is the length and guaranteed money Rios is owed, which would scare away Dombrowski (well, you never know, maybe he hasn’t learned from his mistakes). You’re right though that it is not that bad compared to some others like Wells and Maggs.
I like Rolen a lot and would love to see him in the “D”, but is he peaking this year? And he’s missed some pretty serious time in the past with injuries.
They're both worth it
Rolen is a 3 win player worth about 12 million on the open market (each win = roughly 4 million, more for the Tigers since we’re so close to playoff contention).
Rios is a slumping 4-5 win player with a pretty fair contract.
Money’s an issue, but with this acquisition. we’re making the playoffs unless ChiSox get Halladay. Combine that money with an offseason firesale of big contracts (try to deal Rolen away, deal Inge maybe) and it’s good.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm getting the feeling that the Tigers may not do anything by the non-waiver deadline.
Except maybe try to get some sunflower seeds for Nate.
Tag's restaurant question
Tag—
You are unfortunately out of luck on Thai – and Indian as well (unfortunately for me). There used to be one of each, but the economy hammers the heck out of restaurants that aren’t well established already. I was sad when the Indian place closed. :(
A couple other places that I like a lot are Ghengis Khan Mongolian Barbeque at 5010 Bay City Road (just to the east of town across from Valley Plaza resort, on the left as you come into town). Wonderful atmosphere and since you choose your own stirfry ingredients, any dietary restrictions can be accomodated (important for my dad, since he has diabetes). And since there aren’t dances going on in the schools right now, it won’t be overrun with teenagers in formalwear. Their website is www.ghengiskhanmongolianbbq.com.
Also Genji Japanese Steak House, 2929 S. Saginaw Road. Been there several times for functions at a previous workplace, and loved the food. A friend who is a sushi fan liked their sushi, too.
(Now I am the kind of person who would briefly – BRIEFLY, mind you – consider eating nearly anything if it had teriyaki sauce on it.)
Sorry no Thai. A year or 18 months ago the answer would have been yes. :(
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
You'd love the Seattle area.
At least one teriyaki join on every block. I used to try to eat at a different one any time I went to get teriyaki and I still haven’t run out of places. The PNW loves its teriyaki.
I've been to both...
but I want Thai. I crave Thai. I MUST HAVE THAI. My favorite food.
It’s sad that we don’t have even one in this area. Fuck that.
There is a Genji's in Saginaw as well
I think it is on Bay Rd. Someone from the area help me out, please.
I root for the Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings and yes, the Lions.
www.twitter.com/zajareich
cant make that trade...
Not three young arms for one great arm that you will only have for 15 months. Just can’t do it. We need to do something, though.
by rook34 on Jul 30, 2009 3:13 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Ortiz
NY Times reporting he tested positive for ’roids in ’03. Does anyone care? Just throwing this out there.
I'm sick of it
It doesn’t matter to me how many names come out, I am still going to feel the same way. No team was clean. The rules did prohibit use of illegal drugs but there was no testing to enforce the rule. I have a friend though who was a die-hard Red Soxes fan who says you can go ahead and erease the ’04 and ’07 titles and re-institute the curse of Baba Ruth.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm inclined to agree somewhat...
I’m not sure what they thought was gonna happen when they banned it but never bothered to test or enforce the ban. But so far, any revelations that there have been have not really impacted my opinion of any given player. If I liked the guy before, I still like him. If I did not, I still did not.
Though I do wonder one thing, as someone who works in the healthcare industry. How do all these leaked stories about positive tests not violate HIPAA law?
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions
The same way they don't violate the agreement the union made when they agreed to anonymous testing
They probably do but no one (atleast, no in the media) is coming to the defense of steriod users. Honestly, there are somedays I believe this is still a “story” because we have members of the media who still feel like they are making up for not being more vigiliant on the subject in the late ’90’s.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Good point about the steroid story
The more interesting debate right now is Pete Rose. With steroids, it’s so hazy. But a player/manager betting on baseball? C’mon, rules are rules. But I wouldn’t be surprised to see him get in if Selig reinstates him.
Apparently confidentiality doesn't apply when the media is being overzealous.
I don’t like it either. It’s like charging someone with murder even if they killed someone who needed killin’. Just because you didn’t pay attention when someone was using steroids earlier doesn’t mean that you can make up for the inattention by outing people now.
The performance enhancement stuff is pretty ethically fuzzy in some ways, anyway. When you say you want a “level playing field” what does that really mean? Does it mean that you don’t permit anyone to use drugs that will help their workouts to be more effective or enable them to recover more quickly from injuries (which so many athletes say they use steroids for), and leave questions of who is better to accidents of genetics? Or does it mean you do permit athletes to use chemical (and in the near future, genetic) means to make up for something they were not born with, and let the player who commits to working the hardest – including using performance enhancing drugs and such – to be a better player? What does level and fair really mean?
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
level and fair = not cheating
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
Red Sux
I’m not shocked at all about Ortiz. I am a little shocked, though, that a Red Sux fan would actually say such a thing about their team of infallible, history-making superheros.
The guy is a pretty cool fan
not your typical “Red Sox nation baby” guy. I think he is overreacting and I can say if we had won in ’06 I would have celebrated despite what Kenny Rogers and his smug did.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
'06 World Series win
If Tigs had won in ‘06, I would still be celebrating even if Pudge was caught with one of the Rocket’s needles in his butt right before Game 7.
I don't see the Yankee's parting with either guy for Washburn.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
No
But if that’s where they’re starting, who do we have to offer?
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Also
if that’s what the M’s expect then we might as well move on. I am not nearly as interested in Washburn though as I am in an Adam Dunn.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions
MLB Trade Rumors reports:
Dodgers are close to acquiring George Sherrill
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
They are now saying it's official
I didn’t expect to get him anyway since I think Leyland is comfortable with Lyon in the 8th and Rodney in the 9th. I may not be comfortable with it but Leyland is.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Not a chance in hell
Broxton’s the closer until he dies.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions
sorry if someone already mentioned this
but teahen isn’t in today’s lineup I guess – is he on our radar, or do we assume no, since he wasn’t a part of the josh anderson deal?
would be a great move
put inge on the DL and let teahen and his left handed bat play 3b. when inge comes back, teahen can play LF or RF.
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
true, but
tehan isn’t the type of player that would dominate another team for years to come. he is a nice piece, not more than that…a piece that would GREATLY help the tigers. more than Willingham, in my humble opinion. get tehan and washburn and we’re set.
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
There's been a lot of buzz on here today about Halladay
but honestly, with less than 24 hours to go does anyone expect him to be traded?
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 4:17 PM EDT reply actions
No, I don't
I think the price that Toronto has been asking for him is about right, but I think that price is just too high for all the teams out there.
Year 295 of their latest Five Year Plan for Success?
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Halliday may get traded next year
the blue jays can wait…and who knows, they may have a great team next year…a lot of good injured players coming back
and a lot of fans in the stands with hallifay staying put.
i think the blue jays are playing it right. either get something spectacular, or wait (since you can wait!!!)
Dealt a crappy hand of cards
Why are we stuck in a division that has three of the most trade happy teams in baseball over the past few years? Just throwing talent away like its candy.
Twins
Indians
Royals
But they never want to trade in thier own division. No we have to trade with the stingy teams like the Braves and the Blue Jays.
not only that but...
we have teams blocking us from making moves.
recall that the indians made sure that we would not get JJ Putz last winter.
worked out well though…we got edwin jackson instead =)
i’m still hoping we get teahen, especially since Inge needs to go to the DL
we could, of course, call up larish to play 3b (no more rayburn please)
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Tigers best lineup for Cleveland
(1) Thomas LF
(2) Polanco 2B
(3) Granderson CF
(4) Cabrera 1B
(5) Carlos Guillen DH
(6) Magglio Ordonez RF
(7) Jeff Larrish 3B
(8) Laird C
(9) Everett/Santiago SS
I would have given that up for Halladay.
Who knows what Perry or Crosby will be? Even Porcello, who has been god-awful lately, may or may not pan out. 1.5 years of Halladay? Yes please.
For 18 years of cheap young pitching?
No. A thousand times no. Even if only one of them hit their ceiling, its not worth it unless the other two flame out completely (and the one that hits his ceiling is Perry).
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
18 years?
we have 3 more years of Porcello at a bargain. After that his salary will skyrocket if we want to keep him around. and is he really a bargain this year? his numbers are good for a rookie, but on par with a back of the rotation starter.
Arbitration values are still cheap
6 years of team control per.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions
no way
porcello IS the next halladay. barring injury, he will pan out 100%.
i’d give up any package that does not include him.
perry, crosby, etc… i’d hesitate of wilken ramirez, but i’d let him go to if it means halliday
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions
People call Steven Strausburg the best pitching prospect this decade
And even then there are a lot of people who are skeptical of how well he will do in the Bigs.
People put way too much faith and hype into minor leaguers.
I remember when Matt Anderson was the next can’t-miss sure deal. Enough said.
We're overrating Halladay
At best, he’s worth 10 wins over the course of a sesaon. That’s at absolute best, peak production, nothing goes wrong production. So we get 15 wins for Halladay’s 1.5 seasons in Detroit.
Anyone else here think that Porcello/Perry/Crosby can easily double or triple that number of wins over their combined 18 years of Tiger tenure?
Of course they could.
They could not. Obviously, it would suck to see Porcello tearing it up while Doc is retired. But if we got two playoff years, would it be worth it? I think it might be.
I'm sorry but you have WAY too much faith in minor leaguers
Especially OUR minor leaguers.
How many of our minor leaguers in the last 9-10 years have turned out to be glaring successes for us other than Verlander and Granderson?
And you really think Halladay would only win 10 games for us next year? Wow. Not unless he has a Magglioesque fall off the face of the earth.
10 wins over replacement
And we’re talking short term here- Maybin still has a world of potential for FLA and Jair Jurjjens is pretty good too.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Successes for us though ^^
And if you go beyond Jurrjens Win count and ERA, some of those peripherals aren’t very good. I think he’ll have a quality career but as long as he is on a team like Atlanta. If he were on Washington I’d bet his numbers would be a lot higher.
Who cares if it was for us?
They were OUR prospects.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Except the AL in 2006
Last time I checked, we were anchored by homegrown talent in Granderson, Inge, Verlander and Zumaya that year.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions
NOT trades
We didn’t deal top tier talent away.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions
So you think 1 league pennant in 25 years is a successful franchise?
Way to have high standards.
And I already used Granderson and Verlander as examples so how is that going to be your rebuttal? lmfao
Zumaya? Yeah one hit wonder, thanks for coming. Didn’t pan out very well huh? Inge? So he got voted into the All-Star game by the fans this year and now suddenly he’s a Halladay-level talent? He is my favorite Tiger, but I’m not even that naive to make that comparison.
You're creating arguments
1. My assertion is that you must have home grown, cheap talent in order to make a run into the playoffs. We haven’t had that for the 19 years I’ve been alive except for 2006. That talent was Granderson, Verlander, Inge and Zumaya.
2. No, it’s not successful. And I want this franchise to be succesful, by developing a sustained player development program. We’ve seen how dealing prospects can bite us in the butt (Rentaria?)
Take your strawmen and go home.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions
And I'm using personal attacks?
I’m simply repeating what many smart baseball people know: YOU NEED A STEADY SUPPLY OF YOUNG PLAYERS IN ORDER TO INSURE A HEALTHY AND COMPETITIVE ORGANIZATION.
Seriously? You’re going after my age? Just because I’m younger than you are gives you no right to accuse me of ignorance or some misguided “know-it-all” attitude. Grow up.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Wait til you watch 'em for 50 years
and realize how fleeting a championship team can be. The Tigers are fortunate to have had a championship franchise in ’68, 84 and 06. About once every generation, just to get new fans hooked. It takes a long time to win championships.
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
Longer if you sell your young players
Sorry to keep beating this horse, but I want a competitive team for as long as possible.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions
me too
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
You mean 1 in 24 years.
2 pennants, 1 world series, 2 AL East wins in 25 years.
1984 was 25 years ago.
And we haven't had impact minor leaguers behind Granderson, Verlander, Maybin and Miller
2 for 4 isn’t bad. 3 for 4 will be even better when Maybin starts tearing it up.
Our problem isn’t with our top guys, it’s with system depth. That’s why Rick Knapp frustrates the hell out of me.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions
10 wins over replacement is HUGE!
wouldn’t you like to have 10 more wins and 10 less losses in the standings right now? That puts us 12 games up on the twins.
Over a season
We gain 38% of that, or roughly 4 wins. Minus what we’d lose from Porcello and Perry this year. So probably around 2-3. We can do better.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions
I would consider Porcello to be at about replacement value this year
plus, you have to consider next year we would get all 10 of those.
half a win
http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=2717&position=P
So he evens out to be about a win this year. And what about next year?
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions
you have to consider
Halladay, Verlander, Jackson as our top 3 starters for this year and next. All three of these guys are having career years this year, why not try to catch lightning in a bottle, and make a run for it. 4 years from now, when we’re missing Porcello and Halladay’s gone, there will be another big name free agent starter that we can go after by selling one of our top prospects. This is the difference between the Red Sox/Yankees and the Royals/Indians. Let me ask you, what kind of team do you want to be?
Um... no
Red Sox are notorious about keeping prospects. Yankees kept their best from 1996-2000. A’s deal in young, cheap players all the time. Rays are low-payroll because of those young cheap players.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Something else to consider.
If we got Doc and weren’t (somehow) making a serious World Series push next year, he could be sold for a ton of prospects again.
Very good point
we could be in the position of the Jays at this time next year. Picking up a Porcello type arm.
Less value
1/2 a season of Doc in what is not a sellers market will not fetch us Porcello.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Also
Halladay’s 3 wins might help us get to the playoffs, but Beckett/Lester/staff, Sabathia/Burnett/staff and Shields/staff still look pretty scary. Factor in far better offenses, and we’re gonna need a lot of luck to beat the East Beasts, even with Halladay.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
magglio
Now I would be hypocritical if I didn’t at least mention what I am thinking.
Magglio Ordonez has been awful this season.
David Ortiz has been awful this season.
Ortiz may be bad because he’s coming off injury, but there’s always that side of me that says “he doesn’t have steroids anymore to help him.”
Magglio’s name is one that appears on ESPN.com’s list. Jose Canseco is a POS, but I would be hypocritical if I didn’t say the same thing that I did about Ortiz to Ordonez. Without steroids, he’s not hitting for power anymore.
He could be clean, but let’s be realistic…virtually every other big name, power hitter has used steroids.
Razor Ramon, imo
got all beefed up over the winter and now he’s slim. Same thing with Pudge. Huge during the winter and finally Huston got him. Now, he’s regular size. Maybe it’s all that sweating?
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
i didn't mention them
because they really didn’t play their best years for the Tigers, nor did they play for very long in Detroit.
Let's get a team of top Major Leaguers together
and a team of Top ‘Prospects’ and see who wins in a series….since prospects are all the rage these days
Please
Are you trying to be dimwitted or do you just come off that way?
DD has to look at the health of the organization, not only the ML club. Do you really want to be where the Royals or Pirates are right now a few years down the road? A steady stream of prospects that are both skilled and, more importantly, CHEAP, are key to the success of a major league club. We can’t deal them all away for today.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I would trade a couple of down years in the next 10 years for a world series this year
and a good shot at one next year
What good shot next year?
You don’t think the Twinks and Sox are going to roll over, are you? Meanwhile, the Tigers have hamstrung payroll and no way to make any needed moves. We’re limping into a title this year if we make it- this team is not built for success in the present in any other division in baseball.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not saying we're the best team in baseball
but i just don’t think you can argue with the fact that we would give serious troubles to any team in the playoffs with a top 3 like verlander, jackson, and halladay. and yes, I believe with that rotation along with french, miner, robertson, gallaraga, and whoever else fills the 4 and 5 slots the rest of the way we will beat out the sox and twins for central.
And no offense
Who comes back next year? A good Granderson and Cabrera, but aging players everywhere else, because we dealt away our kids.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I think we'd be allright
losing 3 pitchers wont leave our cupboards empty. we still have a lot of young talented position players that can fill the voids as well as a lot of young bullpen arms. We are a bit thin with starters however. I’m not trying to call you out or say you’re wrong, just glad to get a differing opinion on the trade, and someone to give my side of the story to. I hope there are no hard feelings, I don’t want to start any trouble. Thanks for the “argument” I’ve gotta take off.
No worries
I just don’t have faith in anything not named Crosby, Avilla, Perry or Porcello. A little in Sizemore though.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions
this sounds exactly like the conversations Edmonton Oiler fans are having right now
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
kind of
more like “Dany Heatley” versus “keep the kids we already spent several years of pain developing”
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Red Wings
But there is an Oilers blog that is extremely intelligent, screamingly funny, and very informative – so just because I visit there for the conversation so often I’ve taken on the Oilers as a secondary team by osmosis.
Plus the soap opera nature is fascinating. :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Totally don't get it
But I’m a rookie hockey fan (Carolina Hurricanes FTW).
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Namecalling! Yay!
The bottom line is championships. If it gave us a chance to win you’re damn right I’d trade them all away and turn into the Pirates for another 25 years. The last 25 years hasn’t been a whole lot better in comparison so I can’t see how that would be a downgrade.
Go ahead and think of some more names.
Strawmen! Yay!
I’m saying that we have a healthy organization so that the next 25 years doesn’t suck ass and that we can have more runs at division titles and AL pennants and World Series and fun stuff like that. I’d prefer half a century of competition over one “chance” at a WS title.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions
When I get pissed because I lost an arguement
I start calling people things too. It’s okay, it happens to the best of us.
Look, I'm sorry I called you dimwitted
Now stop putting up strawmen and defend yourself.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions
lesser package for doc
the blue jays INITIALLY asked for porcello, perry, crosby
whatever happened to negotiations?
can anyone think of a lesser package that the blue jays would consider?
I'd do
Porcello, Iorg, Rameriez and one more pitcher not named Perry or Crosby.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd do Perry, Crosby, Iorg...and I think th Blue Jays would seriously consider
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions
anyone else see the double entendres?
Or is that just me? :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
catfight?
He might like that – two ladies fighting for his affections.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I believe that sort of thing (the prior comment) only flies in Braves country.
Har har I made a southern joke.
That's what I was thinking
My mind has been in the gutter since I was 14.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 30, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I think Porcello has to be included no matter what
We don’t have anything else they’d even consider that didn’t include porcello
Their stance is kind of confusing.
I’m not sure why Riccardi would NOT trade him somewhere. They’re not going to make the playoffs, it just seems like a waste. If they would take Perry+Crosby+any other prospect besides Porcello, DD would HAVE to go for that…
according to beck, zumaya is having surgery
and is done for the season
by allikazoo on Jul 30, 2009 5:35 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
bad news for zumaya, but I think tigers will be ok...
need a SP more than anything else.
the offense will come around.
send Inge to DL and bring up Larrish (if he is not traded)
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Good afternoon and thank you for shopping the Pittsburgh Pirates organization.
Our blue light specials are done but I’m sure you can find something else in our bargain bins.
Do they even have a team?
I think it is just Andy LaRoche crying in the dugout after all his friends escaped.
+10
hahaha
“Brother, why have you forsaken me?”
by kendra.michelle on Jul 30, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Andy LaRoche.
He was going potty when the Pirates had the “if you want to be traded please step forward” meeting.
it must be rad/sad to be a prospect for them
“hey mom, I’m goin to the show!”
“so is everyone else on your A/AA/AAA team honey, that’s nice”
The sad part is that they weren't that bad this year
atleast by their standards. Five games under .500 to start July in a division where that meant you were still within 5 or six games of first place. It seemed like this wasn’t your typical 95+ loss Pirate team. I’ve been to several games in Pittsburgh and they have a beautiful stadium and good fans (atleast the few who are left).
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 30, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I didn't even realize they'd traded Morgan to the Nats...
…until I heard Bob Uecker calling his name leading off against the Brewers the other night.
Official BYB Juju Consultant...now accepting rally creature applications!
Washburn?
If Seattle in fact trades Washburn at this point—I’d question the sanity of their management (and their present mangement has seemed on the whole uncommonly sensible).
You can trade prospects for established players at the deadline if your going for the pennant—or you can conclude that you’re not going to win this year, and trade established players for prospects. But you don’t do both. And the Mariners just traded a bunch of prospects and young players away for established players.
So, anyway, I think the Washburn speculation is unfounded . . .
Lookout Landing still says Washburn's numbers are not good.
His ERA is shiny and he’s doing well thanks to defense and Safeco.
The M’s GM, Z-something , has done a good job of fixing a few things quickly.
Wonder if we could get Aaron Harang on the cheap
He’s avaliable- maybe Iorg or Ramirez?
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Any links to Harang being available?
havent heard his name being out there
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe not cheap
But he won’t cost us Porcello.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Greinke can put the pill in D-Trains hand and make sure he swallows it!
is more like it. Do you really think he’d take pills?
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
hey folks
i seem to have joined this a little late. what’s with the namecalling? we’re all tigers fans here.
its ok, i dont object to being called a perv
when I blatantly remark about how I want to sleep with certain ballplayers
It's only a perv if they are underage.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Sorry...
I don’t do well when people make fun of me for my opinions and kinda blew a gasket all over the board. My fault.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions
it happens
we’ve all got different opinions about a team we love. that’s how being a fan is. never gonna agree with everyone else, and sometimes it gets bad when you disagree
I missed most of it when I was flipping over to check the conversation during breaks at work. Everyone gets personal sometimes when discussions get heated – otherwise we wouldn’t be human.
And robots are pretty dang boring in real life.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I can't believe we have 250+ comments and no moves
Whoops. My apologies to Josh Anderson, but I’ll stand by my statement.
I root for the Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings and yes, the Lions.
www.twitter.com/zajareich
so
all we’ve done is get rid of josh anderson for money. zumaya is out for the season (again) and we wait for DD to do something.
spun glass
It’s more delicate.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Once we had a righty that threw gas.
Soon turned out, had an arm of glass.
…I have a soft spot for that song, okay?
Anyone else thinking
about that sterioid commerical with the marble statue falling apart? That could be Joel without the juice…
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Hahaha
With a Guitar Hero controller strap around his torso?
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Especially since it appears he isn't going anywhere
what a tease
by kendra.michelle on Jul 30, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions
BUT WAIT THERE'S MORE
5:07pm: Ricciardi tells Ed Price of AOL FanHouse that he’s not ruling out a trade. “We’re waiting ‘til 4 o’clock tomorrow,” Ricciardi said.
Now we have the fun of the off-season and next year's trade deadline
To see if he gets moved. Anyone want to place bets. I’ll take July 23, 2010
I root for the Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings and yes, the Lions.
www.twitter.com/zajareich
I hope so
Only to stop people from talking about it ad infinitum.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
No I Did Not
Please enlighten me about this “Roy Halladay”, Stranger.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Somewhat relevent aside
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCZfJ5ai07U
Song’s been stuck in my head for a while, and it’s appropriate for our situation…
just like with halladay
I got pretty tired of hearing about this band (I feel they are overrated) but I love that song
See, this is why I love not listening to the radio
All my favorite bands are on hiatus or not popular anymore (NIN, RHCP, Incubus). This way, when I come across a new song I enjoy, it’s not overplayed or overhyped.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Have tickets for the 12th
Can’t wait- though it can’t be better than the NIN|JA tour.
Did they play any of their early stuff (S.C.I.E.N.C.E and Make Yourself)?
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
first 8-10 song were all old stuff. mostly make yourself, a couple from science and a couple from morning view
I oughta see those guys when they come around.
Although I like nothing before Make Yourself, I would assume the majority of the setlist is from that album and onwards, so I think it would rock.
You don't like S.C.I.E.N.C.E?!?!?!
Love that album…. second favorite behind Morning View.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Bah
Love funk-metal… really want to start listening to older RHCP.
You should try Robert Randolph and the Family Band… not exactly softer funk, but it’s pretty awesome.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions
The one and only
Colorblind is one of my favorite albums. Loooooooove the song Diane.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, it was a great show.
my only criticism is that they ended with a prince cover. wish they would have saved “pardon me” or “stellar”
Let's Go Crazy?
Yeah, that was on their Greatest Hits album. Pretty good rendition, but I see what you mean. By the time they stop at Grand Rapids, they’ll probably be playing new songs and ending differently anyways.
and no hard feelings for our Halladay "disagreement" earlier
I enjoy other peoples points of view and trying to express mine. hope you feel the same way
No worries...
I’m a former debater whose gotten into worse screaming matches. Couple good stories there too…
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions
hahaha
good. I don’t want to make any enemies here. I truly enjoy hearing everyone’s point of view. I am not here just to disagree with people, call names, and judge
Really?
KOL are one of my favorites. Such an amazing voice, weird/awesome songs such as this one, Closer, Sex On Fire, altogether good stuff. Although I discovered the band earlier than most people, with their last album.
I do like other songs of theirs besides that one
just don’t feel like the album lived up to the OMG BEST EVER hype. but, to each their own! :)
I could classify nothing from the last two decades as the "best ever"
No way in hell I could do that. This is just good indie melodic rock.
Indie
Blech. Despise that label so much.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, their music certainly isn't straightforward
It has such an odd sound to it, that twists it into a non-mainstream vibe, at least it has felt that way for me. Strangely, the mainstream likes their sound too, probably because it’s melodic.
I like indie. It doesn’t bother me. Of course, I am a music freak and have listened to almost every song in existence, so…
It's more the label
And the group of people associated with it.
Once had an indie friend tell me that Nine Inch Nails wasn’t music because it wasn’t indie (which, ironically, is wrong- they weren’t associated with a major label on their debut and are now independent of major labels).
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:58 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm stuck in my musical ways.
http://www.last.fm/user/forcemajeure
I will say that HNIA is a fun live show.
I don't really talk music much
Because my tastes are kind of strange. And somewhat inconsistent. :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Psh
I’m borderline schizophrenic. Modest Mouse to Incubus to Tool to Kelly Clarkson (don’t judge me) to Disturbed to the RHCP to NIN… and that’s an average day.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
right now my favorite CD's ...
(I have an MP3 player, I’m not a luddite, I just haven’t gotten around to loading my music onto it yet) are Yat Kha, Sting, Beausolei, Ottorino Respighi, Yo-Yo Ma and the Sink Road Ensemble, and R. Carlos Nakai – and the Rough Guide to the Music of Scandinavia (and no, no Abba). And Kornog. And U2.
Is Kelly Clarkson one of those American Idol people?
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I listen to music enough that I find buying an music player a bad idea.
I’d never be headphone free save for the auto.
Is it bad if I say all the American Idol folks sound pretty much the same to me?
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
okay
I kind of thought they did – but I think a lot of stuff on the common radio stations sound the same, too. Especially the country stations (that some other people in my workplace listen to). It’s like one long song with different men and women alternating singing the verses.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I can't tell emo bands apart
So I’m with you with most modern music being garbage.
I’m a child of the 90’s and late 00’s.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions
They do pretty much
Chris Daughtry seemed pretty unique before subsequent seasons had a whole bunch of “rockers” on them.
Yes
Original- she’s actually got a good voice and good songwriters.
And my recent adds:
Suende by Eisbrecher (German industrial-metal outfit- think Nine Inch Nails meets traditional metal)
Street Sweeper Social Club by Street Sweeper Social Club (Boots Riley/Tom Morello rap-funk metal)
Nevermind by Nirvana
Nothing’s Shocking by Jane’s Addiction
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 7:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Just found this article
lack of onine chatter?!?
Clearly they haven’t been around this neighborhood of the internets today. ;)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Had DD been
We would have been the proud owners of Scott Rolen and Alex Rios.
by David Tokarz on Jul 30, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Too bad that is not realistic. He would be perfect:
Granderson CF
Polanco 2B
Choo LF
Cabrera 1B
Guillen DH
Ordonez/Thomas RF
Larish/Inge 3B
Laird C
Everett/Santiago SS
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 7:25 PM EDT up reply actions
The Freep article makes me grumpy...
I can’t believe a 1st place team, hanging on to the division lead despite an uttterly craptastic offense, a gimpy shouldered DH and gimpy kneed 3rd baseman, whose setup man is out for the season, and a rotation anchored by 2 rookies at the 4 and 5 spots, isn’t going to do a thing to improve the team.
The Tigers have made the playoffs 3 times in 25 years. If Dave Dombrowski doesn’t do something by Friday, it’s damn near assured it’ll be 3 times in 26 years.
Way to keep bumming me out, DDB!
Inge is God awful at the plate right now, he needs to sit and get healthy. His power needs to be replaced. The Tigers NEED A DAMN BAT!
Tell Brandon that!
I’m sure he believes he’s the heart of the team. And you know this year is probably his only shot for a gold glove. He ain’t goin down without a fight.
"It's designed to break your heart. The game begins in the spring, when everything is new again, and it blossoms in the summer, filling the afternoons and evenings, and then as soon as the chill rains come, it stops, and leaves you to face the fall alone". A. Bartlett Giamatti
stripe faced fruit bat
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Bats are awesome. This is a fruit bat – but any animal that can eat so many mosquitos each night is fantastic in my book. :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
blah blah blah
Bill Shaikin of the LA Times reports that the Dodgers and Blue Jays spent the afternoon “negotiating extensively” over Roy Halladay. Apparently talks aren’t “dead” after all. The Dodgers would allow the Jays to get a “haul of prospects” but are trying to acquire Halladay without giving up Clayton Kershaw or Chad Billingsley.
Well
another day passes and still nothing. Could it be possible that DD thinks this team can stay in contention just the way it is? Could it be the Mr I. thinks as much too and that’s why he felt free in saying he would do whatever it takes, because he felt like he needed to do nothing??? Fools.
Welcome to Detroit>>Where the weak are killed and eaten.
Baroque
If you read this, make note that fireworks days sell out!
I just spent 15 minutes trying to find a pair of seats that were next to each other and probably got the last pair.
Also, I read something about August 10th and a Chet Lemon bobblehead…
no worries
I purchased a “grass pass” which is 10 lawn admissions to any game I want to go to (even if sold out). I just can’t sit in a seat – WAY too attached to pacing. :)
My first Red Wings game at the Joe was more stressful than I had imagined because I couldn’t pace when Detroit was killing a penalty. I am too used to being able to eliminate nervous energy by moving around instead of sitting in one spot and watching while holding my breath.
And yes, they have had a few games where they celebrated the Tigers 1984 team – August 10th is the last bobblehead giveaway.
Announcement on the radio broadcast of the game – starting tomorrow and for a limited time (it’s an experiment to see how they go over, I guesss) the park will have babyback ribs for sale at one of the kiosks.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Hmm...sounds good to me
‘cept not this weekend….ribs isn’t very good 1st date food, what with the sauce and all
Chicken. :)
What happened to going with the challenging foods right off the bat? Best to get all the good behaviour out of the way right away and see if she shocks immediately. Or maybe that’s just what some of the guys I’ve gone out with have done – and then there were the ones that I wish had done that so I knew to not waste any more time. lol :D
Also, no matter how warm it has been during the day, and you know this but the wimps who leave shivering after six innings don’t, be sure to bring a sweatshirt or fleece because after the fifth or sixth inning the temperature drops – and depending on how exposed your seats are to the wind, it might be quite chilly. Especially since you will be staying for the fireworks.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I’m planning on going to the August game anyway. I always get there early because I generally head over right from work and read a book in line for a while, so I’ll wind up with a bobblehead I don’t want because they creep me out. :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I'd take it off your hands...
I don’t know if it’s a giveaway though….I think I read it’s a drawing or something. You’d think they could come up with more than one bobblehead though.
internet dyslexia :)
First 1000 fans get bobbleheads.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
If you can't make it you can have mine.
Too bad I was running late at work and decided to listen to the game tonight on the radio. It’s currently 10-10 and heading into the 10th inning. Loons scored 2 runs to tie it up in the bottom of the ninth – and the manager was ejected for arguing.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Scored four runs in the 8th to take a two-run lead, gave up 4 runs in the top of the 9th (with officiating help) to trail by two runs again, then scored two more in the bottom of the ninth to send it to extra innings.
Loons currently batting in the bottom of the 10th.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
haha, TCM?
I had to pause it a few times, so I am quitting for the night at about 2:25 into it. will pick it up tomorrow I guess
I'm known to find my attention span for sweeping, boring dramas
but I’ll have a new bottle of whiskey by then anyhow
Sounds like me and "boring" simulation games.
And Tangerine Dream albums. I love those wacky German dudes.
Well kiddos. It’s time. I’m leaving for Texas tomorrow early morning. Take care of the Tigers for me while they are in Michigan.
I'll 1 up that
Will be in Cleveland tomorrow for the game and Saturday’s game. I wanted to go to Sunday’s also, but will be at Cedar Point instead. 2 games is fine anyway.
Should be at least 1 win and I’ll be happy.
carmona pitching tomorrow...should be interesting. wish sheff was still on the team =)
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 11:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Halladay
If Ricardi has a job after this, the owner of the Blue Jays is truly dumber than I thought.
Why?
I think Ricardi is doing a heck of job.
Don’t trade your jewl unless you get something amazing. Especially
if you have a jewl for 1.5 years. You can always trade next year.
Toronto will be good! They have some injured pitchers coming back.
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I completely disagree. They don’t have the money to build around Halladay. They don’t have the pieces there now.
Scott Rolen. The only batting gem this team has. He had a poor 2006 and 2007 and has surprised this year after those dismal seasons. Hitting .320 now with 43 RBI, the average is up but the RBI count is significantly off his average of 105 RBI/season during his previous 13. He’s old, so who knows what next year will turn up for them. Did I mention he’s going to cost them $15m next year? This is just shy of Ordoñez money for next year for what has been 2009 Ordoñez production over the last two.
Vernon Wells. Talk about pain here. Hitting .256 and slugging .404, that’s not bad for $1.5m this year. Then you realize his pay goes up to $12.5m next year! 23/21/21/21 after that through 2014. This is another Ordoñez-esque contract that’s going to get ugly. His best season came in 2003, and since then he’s been sub-.300.
Lyle Overbay. A “can’t hit kid”, he at least comes cheap next year compared to the above two at $7m. Had an insane year in 2003, which have inflated his 162-game average. He’s barely touched that average (76).
Alex Rios. Young, but hasn’t shown any flash by his age (28) that folks around here are used to seeing from Cabrera. Career (six seasons) .989 fielding percentage saves it a bit here, not to mention his $9.7m pricetag isn’t awful considering his age.
Scott Downs. Reduced service over last two years, from what I can only assume are injury-related issues. 1.4 WHIP doesn’t impress me but he’s a lefty. Have left arm, will travel.
And that’s where I get tired. There is some young talent here, but they’re laden with too many big, ugly contracts for average players that they’re headed the same direction as the Tigers right now under Ordoñez/Guillen/Robertson/Willis — just on a smaller scale due to ownership having a smaller wallet in the first place.
by john.kmiecik on Jul 30, 2009 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
good point but
this team will succeed because of pitching and defense.
aaron hill, vernon wells, alex rios, lyle overbay, scott rollen
are all gold glove caliber players. with marcum and other young
pitchers back next year, and holliday, and a few moves, they can
make serious noise. i agree that wells and rios need to step up,
but they don’t need to be a GREAT offensive team…
by Tigersin2010 on Jul 30, 2009 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions
The problem is that they don’t have the money to make any moves. And lest we forget the kiss of death…
They’re in the AL East.
by john.kmiecik on Jul 31, 2009 12:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Just think about how much time Kevin Towers still has to try and trade Jake Peavey.
He could have taken the Cubs offer last December but was holding out for something amazing. That’s why I think the job Shapiro in Cleveland is doing is better. You don’t pass up on opportunities to improve your team because your waiting to be wowed. How does it benefit the Jays to keep paying this guy what they are for the team to finish 4th.
by tigerfaninChicago on Jul 31, 2009 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Peavey doesn't want to leave San Diego though.
He likes his deal there and I think it’d take a golden goose to change his mind.
traded for cash . . .
josh anderson’s departure for some reason reminded me of steve demeter, a light hitting 3rd baseperson I’m barely old enough to remember. demeter, like anderson, was traded away by the tigers for cash.
Now if it plays out the same way this time around, cash will hit .361 for us next year . . .
So I left at around 7
had dinner, went to a movie and for coffee with a friend, and I come back to check on Tigers news and…nothing has happened.
Why am I not surprised?
by kendra.michelle on Jul 30, 2009 11:34 PM EDT reply actions
because that is what the tigers organization does
insert clever comment about being consistent off the field, not on, here
Did I miss something?
Is Bobby Jenks injured? Because Matt Thornton was pitching the ninth.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm an "Ohioan"...
Maybe we go to bed later in Ohio
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions
That'll work too, I guess.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Go Pacific Time Tiger fans.
Usually they yell go away and I shuffle back to the “Tigers fans only” section of Safeco.
I'm discussing yankees/white sox/phillies hatred
with a mets fan friend. for the record, I’m not the phillies hater
I don't dislike them either
I’m trying to make him pick who he’d root for in a yankees v phillies WS. it’s amusing
I'm neutral about the Yankees and Phillies...
…and don’t like the White Sox. I can’t stand the Indians or Red Sox.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I was listening to the Loons
Won on a single in the bottom of the 12th inning – final score 11-10.
Just ended and the first pitch was at 7:10 pm.
And my THROW STRIKES lucky shirt is still undefeated and now has a record of 4-0. :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I washed after the first and second wins, but not after the third.
I think washable lucky, because otherwise they wouldn’t have had to go to extra innings.
(And yes, that was my first thought as the game kept goind – “should I have washed it? I washed it last time!”)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Off-topic, but...
Does anyone here have an iPod Touch? I just got one as an early birthday present, and I downloaded the MLB At-Bat app, and it worked fine when I first started using it, but now I can’t get it to work. It’ll just say “loading” for about thirty seconds and then go back to the menu. I checked my WiFi connection, and that’s fine.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:49 PM EDT reply actions
That's all right
It was worth a shot. By the way, I would NOT recommend trying to follow a thread on this site using an iPod Touch. You will end up scrolling forever.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions
yep, I try on my blackberry sometimes
it froze the browser once! otherwise it’s only worth the effort if I’m REALLY bored with no real internet
Are you saying that we talk too much? :)
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
If he was quicker about making overflow threads this wouldn't happen!
Poor Ian. He takes so much abuse for giving us a place to talk.
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
I guess if we paid attention we could post overflows
in the form of fan posts or whatever. but I never think of it.
This is kind of funny...
I still can’t get the At Bat app to work, but the (free) At Bat Lite app works, and it has Fausto Carmona starting tomorrow AND Saturday for the Indians.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions
I hate trade deadlines, except in the NFL...
This is worse than waiting for the trade deadline to pass in the NHL.
So...a left-handed reliever gives up an RBI single to a left-handed hitter who's average is .193?
WE could have managed THAT much.
And how the hell do you strike out 10 Yankees?
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions
*whose
This is what happens when you combine two thoughts into one sentence (originally read “who’s hitting”)
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 30, 2009 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions
gonna go watch on TV then
Niters all. Hope for a trade tomorrow, I guess
by VegasTigers on Jul 31, 2009 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions
nighty night for me
Got stuff to do in the morning – well, later in the morning, anyway.
Pleasant dreams!
"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a great battle." -- Philo of Alexandria
Night you guys
Knowing me I’ll stay up for an unnecessary two more hours.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions
We made it!
But if you wanted it to stop at 500, we kind of screwed that up.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I shall return...
I feel the need for ice cream
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:11 AM EDT reply actions
Mmm
I may have to follow that trend, or at least get some kind of snack
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions
So...
Shall we go for 600 comments and try to make this thread REALLY unwieldy?
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:27 AM EDT reply actions
Aw man, the Tigers need to have a good next two weeks
I work a LOT next week and it’s gonna be hectic cuz we’re getting new software in the pharmacy, and I doubt the customers will be sympathetic, so I need to have good news to come home to.
Plus, my birthday is on Monday and the Tigers always seem to lose on my birthday. It’d be nice for them to break that trend. AND I’m going to the game on August 15th (As it stands right now, I would get Edwin Jackson, which would be the second time I’ve seen him, oddly enough. I saw him as a Ray a couple years ago).
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:37 AM EDT reply actions
Apparenly ice cream causes me to run away at the mouth...
…or keyboard, as it were.
Must be the sugar.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions
Hopefully their upcoming games will look more like last night than the preceding nights
I’m going out of town this weekend so I’ll miss the Cleveland series. I’m going to the Monday game, so I hope they win a) because I’ll be there, and b) for your birthday! French is pitching that day, and as much as I like him, I’m kind of bummed I’m missing Verlander by a day.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 12:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah...
I absolutely LOVE Verlander, and yet I’ve only seen him once (It was back in ‘07, and he was opposing Edwin Jackson; what a coincidence). I generally only get to go to one game a year. Last year I got Galarraga against the A’s on Fiesta Tigres. That made for some pretty fun times.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions
That's funny that you saw Verlander vs. Jackson
I really want to see JV live, it’s frustrating to miss him by a day. I went to a game back in June and Porcello was pitching. My dad made sure to get tickets for that day because he knows I love Rick, haha. But I’m just glad I get to go at all.
What do they do for Fiesta Tigres? It sounds like a good time.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, last year it was raining before the game so some of the events didn't happen...
…but they usually have a bunch of different types of Latin bands (salsa, mariachi, etc.) stationed around outside the ballpark (this didn’t happen last year because of the rain, though we did see the mariachi band later), and instead of the normal pregame music, they play a lot of Latin music. There’s also an onfield ceremony before the game where the Latin players stand in front of the flag of their home country.
But the rain last year brought us this beautiful sight during the game:
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 1:02 AM EDT up reply actions
That's a great shot!
Looks like you had pretty good seats, too. That sounds really fun. I love Latin music. I’ll have to try and get to one of those one year.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Fiesta Tigres is August 8th this year
I actually wanted to go to that game, but a schedule conflict prevents it, so that’s why I’m going on the 15th.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I was at that game
it rained like crazy before all the events. So no events just a quicky with the flag presentation was pretty much it. But What I do remember is we whupped the A’s 10-2 in spite of Farnsworth loading the bases in the top of the 9th. What a turd. Every one was yelling for him to get off the mound and telling him to go back to NY…was kinda sad.
Welcome to Detroit>>Where the weak are killed and eaten.
Funny line uttered during tonight's Florida Marlins game:
“Will the last Pirate left in Pittsburgh please turn out the lights?”
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 12:52 AM EDT reply actions
No kidding.
The kids that got dealt there are basically eating a death sentence.
by john.kmiecik on Jul 31, 2009 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, I'm outta steam...
It’s time for me to get some shut eye. Perhaps something will happen overnight and I’ll wake up to some news.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
And just as I say that...
…MLB Trade Rumors reports that the Red Sox and Indians are discussing Victor Martinez in a three-team deal.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 1:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I'm calling it a night too.
Hopefully tomorrow we’ll have something concrete to discuss.
by kendra.michelle on Jul 31, 2009 1:31 AM EDT up reply actions
You mean, besides ice cream and Fiesta Tigres? :-p
Good night.
http://tigersamateuranalysis.blogspot.com
by SabreRoseTiger on Jul 31, 2009 1:32 AM EDT up reply actions
I just got here, too...
oh well, where’s that light switch?
Official BYB Juju Consultant...now accepting rally creature applications!
500+ comments on an off day when nothing happened
niiiice
/borat
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Washburn from Seattle
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4368815
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