Evening Prowl: Damon is wishy-washy, Willis is 'terrible,' Coke is starter-candidate
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 17, 2010 5:50 PM EST
in Detroit Tigers News
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PrintWith spring training camp opening soon, the amount of stories to track has increased several-fold. Here's what you may have missed.
- Dontrelle Willis: 'The issue is, I'm terrible'. -- Tigers' fans: 'We noticed two seasons ago.' I considered a full post on Willis, but truth be told, this is a broken record matched only by Damon Watch 2010. There's really nothing to say. He knows he's terrible. We know he's terrible. Whatever.
- Beck's Blog: Coke could still end up a starter -- Reason #431 why you can't really take anything the Tigers tell the media too seriously. GM Dave Dombrowski thought Coke could be a starter. Manager Jim Leyland said he doesn't have enough spring training innings to see, so Coke is a reliever. Dombrowski agreed, Coke is a reliever. Now, Coke says he was told he might be a starter. Holy geez, these guys are fickle. In short: if Coke can start and eat innings effectively, it's a pretty good use of his talents and makes the offseason trade look much better.
- Speaking of wishy-washy ...
- Jon Heyman says Mrs. Damon prefers Chicago to Detroit, but Johnny insists he wears the pants in the family. -- But if he chooses Chicago over Detroit despite a much larger offer from the Tigers, the evidence speaks for itself.
- Wait for it ... wait for it ...
- Ken Rosenthal says Damon does not want to play in Detroit. -- If my Twitter feed is to be believed, Tigers fans are quickly coming to the same conclusion: They do not want Damon to play in Detroit. That is 100 percent definitely not the way you win fans in Motown. As Big Al's tagline says at The Wayne Fontes Experience: In Detroit, you're with with us, or we hate you.
- Tigers' Nate Robertson had groin surgery in November -- Apparently didn't feel comfortable at the end of the season, still didn't in October, had surgery after that.
- Verlander's second home may as well be Lakeland, he's there so much during the offseason, the Lakeland Ledger writes. But saber-enthusiasts excited to learn about pitchers tracking their FIP will be sad to learn Verlander believes ERA is the most important stat. Bright side: he doesn't like wins, anyway. Small steps, right?
- Beck tweets Leyland seems committed to rookie Austin Jackson leading off, so the No. 2 spot in the lineup is what's up for debate.
- Dave Cameron with this always-necessary reminde at FanGraphs: Spring training stats don't matter.
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Imagine Sox with Damon and Pierre in the OF...
Even Maggs might be able to take an extra base on that pair of chicken wings….
by CoreyMichaelDC on Feb 17, 2010 9:35 PM EST up reply actions
-Austin Jackson as Leyland’s lead off hitter is as predictable as Albert Pujols being good this year.
-Max Scherzer will work his magic on JV and get him into FIP! I have faith!
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Let’s hope so.
KURT: get a Max Scherzer interview please!
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
I do not like the idea...
Sure if Jackson hits like gang busters out the gate go for it…
Looking at the numbers Sizemore looks like a better option to me… He can take a walk and isnt slow…
For me I would rather see OBP in the lead off man than speed… Sure you don’t want a slowpoke that cant go 1st to 2rd, but speed is overrated…
Exhibit B why spring training stats don't matter:
Juan Rincon. Also, I hope they’re being fickle about Jackson leading off. That has disaster written all over it.
by the way,
2 points if you caught the reference.
3 points if you caught any other references that I find humerous.
Points can be redeemed for, uhm, shits and/or grins.
A reference to what?
Do you mean your use of the epithet “wishy-washy,” which was often used by Peppermint Patty to describe Charlie Brown?
by frisbeepilot on Feb 17, 2010 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
PSYCH!
the show. not the thing you say when you’ve just tricked someone.
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 18, 2010 8:20 PM EST up reply actions
I can't believe I didn't catch it...
I love that show.
My Music: Now on last.fm!!
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
I watch it too,
but I’m still missing the reference. Help.
by StringTheory on Feb 18, 2010 9:34 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe I'm late to this party, but...
Dontrelle isn’t taking any meds or getting any treatment for his anxiety disorder? That just seems irresponsible…
“The Tigers viewed Willis as the deal-clincher when they traded six players to the Marlins for a package highlighted by Miguel Cabrera. His new team was so thrilled to have a big-innings, power-pitching left-hander on the roster that Willis was signed for $7 million in 2008, and to a two-year extension: $10 million for 2009, $12 million for 2010.”
Is there any evidence to support this? Somehow, this paragraph comes immediately after Henning acknowledges that Dontrelle’s numbers from the previous year were ugly.
I always suspected that the Willis contract was in part a show of organizational commitment meant to entice Miguel Cabrera to stay. I don’t know if they are friends or whatever, but to me it seemed to be about charting the course for the future based on that trade. And the one person they really wanted to get the message was Miggy.
An expensive and risky message, and I’m just guessing, but my theory seems to make as much or more sense than Lord Lynbert Hennington’s proclamation that Willis was the “clincher.” I’d guess the perennial MVP candidate was more of the clincher.
I really don't think you sign a guy to a three year extention
if you don’t really like the guy. The Tigers obviously thought they had something valuable in Willis.
Exactly....
….and it didnt work out….yet anyway.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 17, 2010 7:01 PM EST up reply actions
And truthfully, it probably will not
but I think it’s disingenuous to claim that Willis was merely a bullet the Tigers bit, rather than a player they were definitely interested in.
I think I overstated the point
I don’t think he was “a bullet the Tigers bit,” but I think they may have meant to send a broader message by signing him to a deal that everyone thought was above market when they could have let him play out the year (or even just start well) and prove that the second half of 07 was an aberration.
I certainly agree they were interested and optimistic that he would be a workhorse. But I disagree that he was the “clincher” in a deal for Miguel Cabrera. And I don’t know why Henning insists on saying things like that.
that Cabrera deal doesn't happen without Willis
- There were reports of the Tigers interest in Willis before Cabrera hit the market
- Reports also indicated that the Marlins would hold on to him because they got no substantial offers (hint, hint!)
- The Tigers were unwilling to put both Maybin and Miller in a deal for Cabrera (and see what the Dodgers, Angels, and Giants were giving up)
- The Marlins then proposed the deal, as it went down, and DD decided to take it, as is. The who’s who of the Tiger system (plus Rabelo)
- Then, we’re reading about how the Tigers had a scout that was impressed with Willis in September. Boy, did he whiff on that one.
What’s even more off base is that Henning wrote that Dontrelle went down hill AFTER being acquired by the Tigers. Actually, there wasn’t a lousier starting pitcher in the NL in 2007.
Mr. H also wrote that Magglio needed 560 plate appearances. Actually, it’s 540, or 135 starts.
Oh, and I’m still waiting for that Bonderman for Teixeira trade to go down.
The Tigers being unwilling to trade Maybin and Miller for Cabrera really, really makes me question the front office. Good lord.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
by Mike Rogers on Feb 18, 2010 12:49 AM EST up reply actions
Check out the other names offered/ wanted for Cabrera
Matt Kemp, Clayton Kershaw, Jered Weaver, Nick Adenhart, Howie Kendrick, Tim Lincecum (back then), Matt Cain…. the list goes on.
Just rumors, but there’s usually something there in what’s reported.
Here’s the list following Miggy on Rotoworld:
http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_previousnews.aspx?sport=MLB&id=3702
It’s interesting to go back and follow the time line of that trade. The same can be done with Willis. Everyone thought the world of Maybin and Miller when that deal went down.
I remember people saying that Maybin's bat had more upside than Cabrera
and couldn’t figure out when the alien overlords replaced Maybin with their clone of Willie Mays.
Hey.
Johnny Damon just pushed me off his own bandwagon. Ouch, my aching ankle.
Baseball Geek
by StorminNormanCash on Feb 17, 2010 6:25 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Wow, 24 hours ago practically the entire blogosphere was proclaiming that Damon signing with the Tigers was inevitable
Now that sentiment seems to have swung toward the White Sox, despite the monetary difference. What happened with that?
As for me, if he signs with the Braves, fine. I just don’t want his bat in a division rival lineup.
That’s at least more rational than the “Fine, let the Sox have him” attitude. If the White Sox sign him, then assuredly they win more games, and in turn, we lose more games. I care about winning, not having 25 players with peachy personalities and likeable agents.
by StringTheory on Feb 17, 2010 7:01 PM EST up reply actions
A team full of Sean Caseys would probably be a pleasure to root for.
But we also wind up with 400 runs, dwelling in the cellar. This is pro athletics. Sometimes, you’ve just gotta take a few jerks to make yourself a good team.
I feel bad for Dontrelle. I know he’s making millions not doing anything, but his entire life he’s been good at baseball and now he’s not. I can’t imagine how much that has to eat at him.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Do the YIPS ever go away?
or does it really just depend on the player?
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
Is YIPS a new Sabremetrics stat?
Does Dontrelle lead the league in field-adjusted YIPS?
by explosivo2k2 on Feb 17, 2010 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
Try him as a position player!
You lose nothing, right? Unless they can truly collect insurance on him.
Trouble with Damon already!
Beside he not going to hit like he did in a Red sox and Yankee uniform.
Per ESPN Insider at just before 6:00......
….Damon doesnt want to play for Detroit and that hes mulling an offer from Chicago that is less then Detroits…..Also states that the Tigers may not deal with Boras clients in the future if this falls through becasue of how hard he lobbied for Damon and he just may go elsewhere to play.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 17, 2010 7:10 PM EST reply actions
If he hasn't signed by now...
…hell, let him go somewhere else. Take the hint, Dave, and get a guy who actually wants to be here.
by frisbeepilot on Feb 17, 2010 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
+1
I’m really kind of pissed now.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
by David Tokarz on Feb 17, 2010 9:27 PM EST up reply actions
I. Want. That. App. Someone help me out (droid phone).
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Never mind, found one.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
It reminds me...
Of the magnetic necklaces worn by Guillen and Granderson…
Like the article says, anything to get an edge…
Except this one probably works…
The worst thing about the Damon waffling
Is that it’s like getting a play-by-play of Favre’s deliberations as he tried to make a decision. Tiresome and ANNOYING!
Just make a damn decision, choose a job offer, and SHUT UP you stupid caveman!
"While there's life, there's hope." --Cicero
LMAO @ U
you’re always so nice always seem to let logic take the place of emotion…. now you just sound like me. Excellent. I love it.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
I don't like Damon
He’s such an airhead. Whatever the male equivalent is of the stereotypical dizzy blonde cheerleader, that’s him.
:)
"While there's life, there's hope." --Cicero
kids?
I can only hope they didn’t replicate their indecisive airhead genes already. More than enough of those in the population right now.
"While there's life, there's hope." --Cicero
Too late
From Damon’s Wikipedia article:
Damon married his high school sweetheart, Angela Vannice, in 1992 when he was 19. They had twins together, Madelyn and Jaxson, in 1999 before divorcing in 2002. In 2004 Damon married Michelle Mangan, who gave birth to their first child, Devon Rose, in 2007. Johnny and Michelle welcomed their second daughter, Danica Rayne, in 2008
by SabreRoseTiger on Feb 17, 2010 9:33 PM EST up reply actions
I was afraid of this.
It’s time to lose Boras’ phone number. We just got used.
Let the White Sox have him.
I never trusted Scott Boras. I don't why anyone else did.
He HAS been awfully quiet the past few days, which seems out of character. But here’s a discussion question for everyone: We know which team Mrs. Damon wants her husband to sign with, but which team does Scott Boras want Damon to sign with?
by SabreRoseTiger on Feb 17, 2010 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
That actually maybe the only way Damon ends up in Detroit
If reports regarding what has been offered are accurate than Chicago is no where near what Detroit has offered. We have a history of over paying for Boras clients while Kenny Williams and the White Soxes have a history of avoiding dealing with him … still, if Damon wanted to sign with Detroit he would have already. If he signs with the White Soxes I say put a fastball in his back the first time he comes to the plate at Comerica.
I can't believe I ate the whole thing!
by tigerfaninChicago on Feb 17, 2010 11:10 PM EST up reply actions
Stop with Damon...
I’m over him. He’d be a nice addition to this team but I won’t cry if he ends up somewhere else. Dontrelle Willis won’t ever be anything in a Detroit uniform. I’m impartial about Nate. Verlander rocks. Commiting a rookie to leading off scares me more than a little but than again, who else can we put there?
My Music: Now on last.fm!!
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
If we know ONE thing about Boras
it is that he’ll push and push and push until he gets what he wants. If he has to wait until the last minute, he’ll do that too. He’ll create competition. Never sign an extension before free agency. Always have several bidders. If there isn’t a second club interested, create something. Threaten retirement, Japan, Korea, or a run for Congress. Whatever it takes to create an alternative so your club doesn’t think you’re the only game in town. DD knows this, and he’s just waiting it out. You have to be prepared to do that if you’re going to negotiate with Scott Boras.
When was Ordonez signed? February, 2005. And Pudge? February, 2004. In each case, the Tigers were the highest bidder. I just hope we’re not back to the days when DD has to out bid every other club to get a free agent to sign with Detroit. And I’d rather not see Damon pull a Pavano and take a lower offer to go to a competitor.
I'm off the wagon!
Don’t follow me miggy!
by 77bestrookieclassever on Feb 18, 2010 5:52 AM EST reply actions
Bull Stuff
So now Damon is nowhere so another dream tale by Tiger management. Is there a worse team or management anywhere? Led by that arch hypocrite Jim Leyland. Just cancelled my MLbb TV contract.
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