What's your Detroit Tigers' 2010 roster look like right now?
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 7, 2010 10:56 PM EST
in Morning Lede
162 comments
Pitchers and catchers don't open their workouts for another 11 days or so. But we've been having a lot of discussions about what moves are left for the Tigers to make before the season opens in April. So now might be as good a time as any to look at your 25-man roster if the season opened today, as well as the opening-day lineup.
The reason I say "today" and not "what do you think it will look like in April" is because it helps to identify holes and surpluses. (Although at this point in the season I think we've all done a great job on that.) Also, it's really hard to predict moves. Who would have thought Josh Anderson would be a Detroit Tiger at this point last season.
Let me say up front I generally don't like to play this game until midway through spring training, but there's no reason we can't do another round in about five or six weeks. We'll all have better ideas of what to expect then and make better selections. Also note, this isn't my ideal roster and lineup. Just what I think the Tigers would do.
Without further adieu, I'll show you mine after the jump, but you have to show me yours. I've given some added information on why I think things shake out like this, and what moves I think it would be wise for the team to make. But you don't have to.
25-man roster
Starting Pitchers (5)
1. Justin Verlander -- RHP
2. Max Scherzer -- RHP
3. Rick Porcello -- RHP
4. Jeremy Bonderman -- RHP
5. Nate Robertson -- LHP
Relief Pitchers (7)
6. Zach Miner -- RHP -- Long
7. Phil Coke -- LHP -- middle
8. Fu-Te Ni -- LHP -- middle
9. Joel Zumaya -- RHP -- middle
10. Ryan Perry -- RHP middle
11. Bobby Seay -- LHP middle
12. Jose Valverde -- RHP -- closer
Catchers (2)
13. Gerald Laird -- RH
14. Alex Avila -- LH
Infielders (6)
15. Miguel Cabrera -- R
16. Scott Sizemore -- R
17. Adam Everett -- R
18. Brandon Inge -- R
19. Ramon Santiago -- S
20. Brent Dlugach -- R
Outfielders (5)
21. Magglio Ordonez -- R
22. Carlos Guillen -- S
23. Ryan Raburn -- R
24. Clete Thomas -- L
25. Austin Jackson -- R
Opening Day Lineup
1. Austin Jackson --CF -- R
2. Ryan Raburn -- LF -- R
3. Carlos Guillen, DH -- S
4. Miguel Cabrera -- 1B -- R
5. Magglio Ordonez -- RF -- R
6. Scott Sizemore -- 2B -- R
7. Brandon Inge -- 3B -- R
8. Gerald Laird -- C -- R
9. Adam Everett -- SS - R
Others who I really considered
I really thought about Robinzon Diaz as backup catcher to give Avila more time behind the plate in Triple-A Toledo. But I left like with all the right handers on the team currently, the Tigers needed to have a left-handed (with some pop) option off the bench. Diaz would need a 40-man roster spot, too. And, I felt like if the continued growth of Avila was such a big deal to the Tigers in the first place, they'd have left him in the minors longer last season.)
I feel like Daniel Schlereth needs Detroit to get rid of a left-handed reliever to get a role in the bullpen. If the Tigers manage to trade Bobby Seay, for example, he'd make the pen. But right now, there's no room. There are already three lefties there and everyone in the bullpen has more experience and major league success.
The problems with this roster
The starting rotation is too right-handed, especially considering the AL Central competition. (The relievers may appear too left-handed, but Seay's splits are like having a switch hitter in the bullpen.)
The lineup is way, way, way too right-handed. As it stands, one members of the projected stating lineup can bat left handed. And he is the switch-hitting Guillen. Avila and Thomas give two left-handed bats off the bench, while Santiago gives the Tigers a switch-hitting option. So that helps to balance things a bit, as you know the Tigers' lineup will vary quite a bit from day-to-day.
Moves to make
Find room for another left-handed batter in the lineup. Signing the switch-hitting Felipe Lopez and starting him at second while easing in Sizemore would be one way to do that. But that would only work if Lopez would agree to a one-year deal, because the position should be Sizemore's in 2011 and beyond if he proves he's capable, which I expect he will. That would move Dlugach to the minors.
Signing Johnny Damon and starting him in left would be another way to do that. It would probably bump Clete Thomas back to the minors. Either guy would slide in near the top of the lineup and make things a lot easier on Leyland, who could then bat Ordonez third and Guillen fifth.
Move a left-handed pitcher. This isn't a big necessity, honestly. But if you need to free up some salary room, Bobby Seay could be expendable. If it's not about salary, probably Fu-Te Ni. I like him, but maybe he'll have some added value due to the fact he's cost-controlled and found success his rookie season.
Conclusion
This roster needs work. Outside of the top three starting pitchers and the back of the bullpen, it doesn't necessarily have anything to hang its hat on. The lineup is too right-handed, and lacks for power, on-base percentage, speed and experience.
As it stands, this roster does not pass the eye-test for winning a division.
Fortunately, I think it will look different by the time the season starts. At least, I hope so.
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Bonus thoughts:
1. If Robertson doesn’t earn a spot, he’ll be cut loose and the Tigers will eat his salary, I believe, rather than try to cram him in the bullpen. I just don’t think that helped Robertson or the Tigers last season. He had two years on his contract then, but just one now.
2. Casper Wells needs to bat left-handed to find a spot in this lineup. Brennan Boesch does bat left handed, but it’s hard to find room for him in 2010. I’m not real sold on him. He’s a platoon batter with limited defensive skills. Thomas gives a late-innings defensive replacement for all three outfield spots and has proven more at the MLB level.
Thoughts
What Thomas proved in the last two months is that he didn’t belong in the majors.
Funny how Bull Durham works with him and he improves, then legendary Lloyd gets him and he has that big loop back in his swing. He has some serious adjustments to make.
Robertson will probably be forced into the rotation, for better or worse, for 10 million reasons, plus he’s a lefty and some have the mistaken belief that matters. It doesn’t unless he gets batters out more than the other guys. I agree that sending him to the pen would be a mistake, especially with so many other lefties down there- where it does matter that he’s a lefty.
Ideally, we get Bonderman, Robertson, Willis, and Galarraga all pitching well this spring, and DD can move one of them.
by Tigerdog1 on Feb 8, 2010 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m skeptical of this. Do people actually witness Clete improving when he goes down to Toledo or is this just media-hearsay?
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
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I think it's media heresy
(intentional typo). Clete Thomas is a bum. There, I said it. Although he did account for one of the better moments of idiotic commentary on ESPN when Rick Sutcliffe said, and I quote, that he has “tremendous power”. And this was even in the early innings, so he couldn’t have been that drunk yet.
by ChrisDTX on Feb 8, 2010 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Fun game
Here’s mine
Starting Pitchers (5)
Justin Verlander
Max Scherzer
Rick Porcello
Jeremy Bonderman
Nate Robertson
Relief Pitchers (7)
Zach Miner- long relief
Phil Coke- long relief
Fu-Ti Ni- LOOGY
Casey Fien- mop-up/7th inning guy
Ryan Perry- setup guy
Joel Zumaya- setup guy
Jose Valverde- closer
Lineup (9- duh)
LF Johnny Damon
RF Magglio Ordonez
1B Miguel Cabrera
DH Carlos Guillen
2B Scott Sizemore
3B Brandon Inge
CF Casper Wells
C Gerald Laird
SS Adam Everett
Bench (4)
SUPER-UTIL Ryan Raburn
INF Ramon Santiago
OF Clete Thomas
C Alex Avila
Bench (4)
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
And why is this?
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
by David Tokarz on Feb 7, 2010 11:50 PM EST up reply actions
I asked for today's rosters!
You cheated … Unless you know something about Johnny we don’t ! ;)
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 8, 2010 1:18 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'll put my reasoning down here
Might be helpful to break up the text.
Robertson has rebound written all over him. Bondo’s on short notice- any arm problems and he hits the DL faster than David Chadd drafts starting pitchers. Replace him with either Dontrelle Willis or Armando Galaragga.
Seay goes to the Mets for Zach Lutz, who serves as our third base depth. Replacing him are Ni as LOOGY and Coke as a long reliever/spot starter. Perry gets shifted to setup, and when Zumaya hits the DL, we call up Scherleith to take his spot.
Damon gets signed. Period. Guillen plays at DH and serves as emergency 3B- getting plenty of starts there in Spring Training and a couple scattered throughout the year. Wells is the big shock here- he wins the CF job over Jackson, who gets 500 PA in Toledo, and some distance between himself and Curtis Granderson. If Wells pans out, he can slide to RF after Ordonez leaves (or we slide Ordonez to LF to accommodate Wells’ arm and defense). If not, well, at least we didn’t rush Jackson.
Raburn is the super-utility player on the team- he plays 140-150 games at 3B, 2B and in all three OF spots- he’ll be a defensive replacement in blowouts at the IF positions to stay sharp (and also in spring training). Raburn will make great insurance for Murphy’s Law. Santiago and Thomas are locks- solid 5th IF and 4th OF, respectively. Avila goes into a job-sharing routine with Laird- starting against at least half the time (play the matchups, Jim!).
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
by David Tokarz on Feb 7, 2010 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
i like it
ditto on maggs as #2 hitter. why not?
They're called double plays...
by metatron5369 on Feb 8, 2010 9:38 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I like except.....
….I think Jackson is better then Wells and he will get 500 pa at the big league level…..Jackson will hit over .260 as a rookie and swipe 20 bags.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Perfect
Agree to all. Wells and Robertson should be on this team. let’s give A-Jax a bit more time in AAA, find some ABs for Raburn, and get Damon at the top of the lineup.
It’s too bad the tigers won’t follow this plan. I think this lineup card would have a shot at the AL Central in 2010.
A lifelong Tigers fan
What is different about....
….wells and jackson…..how much expierience does wells have?
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 2:28 PM EST up reply actions
AA
He’s a power/speed guy with good plate discipline and great defense.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
Ok....
…….so all Ajax needs is a lil plate discipline to be pretty much on the same level?
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 6:53 PM EST up reply actions
And power.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
And defense
A-Jax has potential, more than Wells probably does (his age and weird swing are strikes against him) but it is absolutely essential we avoid rushing the kid.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
Right.....
…..That why I think if he struggles in April and May he will be sent down.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 9:14 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think they’ll send him down quickly. We tend to give players, long, long, long extended looks. Neifi Perez and Craig Monroe, anyone?
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Those guys are veterans
This is a rookie. Granted, Leyland did have a Clete Thomas fetish…
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
Well, there are few rookies to point to with this current regime that are in a Sizemore/Jackson situation: i.e. the ones that were (Verlander/Zumaya) were successful out of the gate.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Close.......
The one I would change out is Casper Wells for Wilkin Ramírez, and that is only if the Tiger don’t trade Seay & Gallaraga to the Mets for Switch Hitting Ángel Pagán. If they do get Pagan then he leads off for me. But as it stands now with out Damon or Pagan my line up is:
Opening Day Line Up:
1-CF Wilkin Ramírez
2-RF Magglio Ordonez
3-LF Ryan Raburn
4-1B Miguel Cabrera
5-DH Carlos Guillen
6-3B Brandon Inge
7-C Gerald Laird
8-SS Adam Everett
9-2B Scott Sizemore
5 Starters:
10-Justin Verlander
11-Max Scherzer
12-Rick Porcello
13-Jeremy Bonderman
14-Nate Robertson
Relief Pitching:
15-Zach Miner
16-Joel Zumaya
16-Ryan Perry
17-Ni, Fu-Te
18-Phil Coke
19-Bobby Seay
20-Jose Valverde
Bench Players:
21-Ramon Santiago
22-Clete Thomas
23-Alex Avila
24-Don Kelly
25-Jeff Larish
by TigersFan1957 on Feb 8, 2010 10:14 PM EST up reply actions
Pick up 2 drop 2
Pick up Damon & Pagan & Drop Kelly & Larish My Lineup would be:
1-CF Pagan
2-LF Damon
3-RF Ordonez/Thomas
4-1B Cabrera
5-DH Guillen
6-3B Inge/Raburn
7-C Laird/Avila
8-SS Everett/Santiago
9-2b Sizemore/Santiago/Raburn
This line up would change depending on who was playing but with this team I could see the tigers running away with the Central Division in 2010……&……Maybe another World Series Appearance…….
by TigersFan1957 on Feb 8, 2010 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
Ramirez can't play center
He’s average defensively in a corner.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
I would replace
Dlugach with Kelly, but other than that, my 25 would be the same.
Lineup prediction (cringes):
1. Raburn, DH
2. Sizemore, 2B
3. Ordonez, RF
4. Cabrera, 1B
5. Guillen, LF
6. Inge, 3B
7. Laird, C
8. Everett, SS
9. Jackson, CF
this looks more like a lineup I would go with too
I just can’t see Maggs batting 5th. I know he batted lower in the lineup last year, but he didn’t start off there it was a whole different set of circumstances . I see it more the way you have them lined up.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
25 Man
Starting 5:
1. Verlander
2. Porcello
3. Scherzer
4. Bonderman
5. Robertson
Relievers
Minor – Long Relief
Galarraga – Long Relief
Valverde – Closer
Zumaya – setup man
Seay – middle relief
Coke – LOOGY
Perry – middle relief
Batting Order
1. Ryan Raburn – LF
2. Scott Sizemore – 2B
3. Magglio Ordonez – RF
4. Miguel Cabrera -1B
5. Carlos Guillen – DH
6. Brandon Inge – 3B
7. Austin Jackson – CF
8. Gerald Laird – C
9. Adam Everett – SS
Bench
INF – Ramon Santiago (should platoon with both Everett and Sizemore so each get the same number of ABs)
C – Alex Avila
OF – Clete Thomas
Super Utility – Don Kelly just because he can play both infield and outfield
As does Clete
Which I don’t think was mentioned (or stressed) in the main post. So lefties are Kelly, Clete, Avila with switchies being Guillen & Santiago. I think there’s a shot Kelly makes the team over Dlugach — especially if the Tigers don’t make a move for another LH bat before ST. I’d say another LH is still a need, for sure, though.
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lineup card
With Damon I would feel much better about the Tigers’ lineup (without question), but there are still a lot of concerns. First and foremost, how to have guys on base for Cabrera (who seems poised to have a stud year). Sure, Cabrera did not shine with men in scoring position last year, but I expect that to change. So, my bigger concern is that there are actually men ON BASE this year.
Here are my thoughts on the lineup:
1) [DAMON] — Having Jackson lead-off is ridiculous. Too much pressure for him as a rookie. So let’s say that we do pick up Damon. He’d be perfect at lead off. I’d like to see him foul off a million pitches in our uniform for once. He would be an improvement on Granderson as a leadoff hitter. Without a doubt.
2) [ORDONEZ] — Ummmm…. I don’t like Sizemore here. This is where we need another established hitter to put ahead of Cabrera. Why not Magglio? I can accept that he’s not the power hitter that he used to be. But even if he doesn’t hit homers, he drives the ball into the gaps, hits the ball the other way, and (if healthy) will almost assuredly hit right around or above .300.
3) [CABRERA] — I like him here with protection behind him in…
4) [GUILLEN] — If he’s healthy, like he was for a short stretch last year, he should hit. I think that he HAS TO hit for us to compete. I’ll be rooting hard for Carlos this year. If he doesn’t hit (or whoever’s behind Miguel doesn’t), Cabrera won’t get the chance to hit.
5) [INGE] — Swing for the fences Brandon. I’m willing to accept your strikeouts if you hit as many home runs as last year. And if you’re up in the order maybe there will actually be someone on base to drive in…
6) [SIZEMORE] — Should be fun to see what he can do. Lower in the order would be less pressure. Should have a bit of pop too.
7) [LAIRD] — Couldn’t possibly suck at the plate as bad as he did last year. Right? I mean… right?… C’mon Laird, maybe try not swinging so hard, so you can actually hit the ball. If G.Laird can at least hit .250 that would be progress. And (the only positive that I saw from last year at the plate) he walks a lot.
8) [EVERETT] — Or as low as possible. But hey, he got big hits last year. Still wish we’d trade for a better hitting shortstop. I think that DD is still stinging from the Renteria fiasco. And don’t get me started on Neifi Perez. It’d be great to see Ramon Santiago get 100 games (between SS and 2B) this year.
9) [JACKSON] — Move him up in the order if he proves that he can hit… but this takes pressure off him and also puts a speedster in a double leadoff spot. I think that people are putting too much pressure on Austin offensively. If he can do okay and patrol CF as well as the hype indicates, I would be okay with a solid, young defensive CF. I’d rather see him playing well in the field and getting big league at bats, then sending him down to AAA because of our unrealistic expectations.
I’m not as concerned about the pitching… but I’d like to see Galarraga or Coke in the starting 5 and let Robertson go.
my rotation/lineup uhhhhh lineups....
Starting Pitching: (5)
1) Justin Verlander (duh)
2) Rick “I throw grumpy old men in the dirt” Porcello
3) Max “if only my one eye was red so I could see you in 3d” Scherzer
4) Jeremy “I’ll beat you with my rib” Bonderman
5) Armando “you can’t spell my last name” Galurahggguh
Relief: (7)
Kung Fu Ni
Phil Coke
Zach Miner
Ryan Perry
Joel Zumaya
Bobby Seay
Jose Valverde(closer)
Batting Lineup: (9)
1) Ryan Raburn-LF
2) Magglio Ordonez-RF
3) Miguel Cabrera-1B
4) Carlos Guillen-DH
5) Scott Sizemore-2B
6) Brandon Inge-3B
7) Gerald Laird-Backstop
8) Adam Everette-SS
9) Austin Jackson-CF
Bench: (4)
Ramon Santiago-2B/SS/sometimes 3B
Clete Thomas- Backup OF
Alex Avila- Backup Backstop
Don Kelly-Plays where he’s needed
NOTES: This roster has some changes if Damon signs. Guillen will get some time at 3B during the season.
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I like the batting lineup,
and it would be mine too. Too bad Leyland probably won’t see it our way.
by StringTheory on Feb 8, 2010 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
6 man rotation
1. Justin Verlander
2. Rick Porcello
3. Max Scherzer
4. Jeremy Bonderman
5. Nate Robertson
6. dontrelle willis
AT LEAST FOR 5 STARTS A PIECE, BY THAT TIME SOMEONE (#4-#6) SHOULD SHOW THEY DONT BELONG AND WILL BE CUT, OR A COUPLE WILL PROVE THEY DO AND WE CAN KEEP ONE AND TRADE OTHER FOR DRAFT PICK OR BACK UP 3RD BASEMAN.
When theres a huge gap between the top and bottom of your rotation in terms of skill
you never, ever go with a 6 man rotation.
WTF?
Are you crazy? you’d be limiting the amount of starts the best 3 pitchers get…
I would go with a 4-man rotaion instead of 6-man…
Bill James did a study awhile back in favor of using 4 man rotations… He concluded, that as long as pitch-counts were limited, that the risk of injury doesnt increase…
how good could the tigers be if Verlander got 40 starts?
not 100 pitches...
but as long as he didnt go 120+ for multiple games in a row it could work…
He concluded, that as long as pitch-counts were limited, that the risk of injury doesnt increase…
This is pitching. Risk of injury increases substantially when the leg kick starts. And really that whole quote just contains hopeless idealism regarding any rotation.
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I really think....
…..that Willis will win the 5th spot….Call me crazy but its only one start a week and if he proves he can find the plate again then I think he will get that 5th spot.
Cah-razy.
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by Mike Rogers on Feb 8, 2010 4:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I can't see him
ever doing much for the money he’s being paid.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
Roster
There’s what I think the roster WILL be and then there’s what I think it SHOULD be.
No point in speculating on Damon, Luke Scott, Felipe Lopez, or anyone else yet, but I think the Tigers DESPERATELY need help in the lineup, especially at the top of the order.
25-man roster
Starting Pitchers (5)
1. Justin Verlander — RHP
2. Rick Porcello — RHP
3. Max Scherzer — RHP He’s not even close to Porcello
4. Jeremy Bonderman — RHP
5. Nate Robertson — LHP but should be Armando Galarraga, and I don’t care about lefties in the rotation whatsoever. It doesn’t matter one iota. What’s their excuse for Willis gonna be this year?
Relief Pitchers (7)
6. Zach Miner — RHP — Long
7. Phil Coke — LHP — middle but should be set up
8. Fu-Te Ni — LHP — middle
9. Joel Zumaya — RHP — middle
10. Ryan Perry — RHP middle
11. Bobby Seay — LHP middle but may be traded
12. Jose Valverde — RHP — closer
Catchers (2)
13. Gerald Laird — R
14. Alex Avila — L
Infielders (6)
15. Miguel Cabrera — R
16. Scott Sizemore — R
17. Adam Everett — R
18. Brandon Inge — R
19. Ramon Santiago — S
20. Don Kelly- IF/ OF- L
Outfielders (5)
21. Magglio Ordonez — R
22. Carlos Guillen — S
23. Ryan Raburn — R
24. Clete Thomas — L
25. Austin Jackson — R
Opening Day Lineup- What I think it will be
1. Austin Jackson -CF - R
2. Ryan Raburn — LF — R
3. Magglio Ordonez — RF — R
4. Miguel Cabrera — 1B — R
5. Carlos Guillen, DH — S
6. Scott Sizemore — 2B — R
7. Brandon Inge — 3B — R
8. Gerald Laird — C — R
9. Adam Everett — SS – R
Opening Day Lineup- What I think it should be
1. Vacant until DD gets a bona fide lead off man
2. Ryan Raburn — LF — R
3. Magglio Ordonez — RF — R
4. Miguel Cabrera — 1B — R
5. Carlos Guillen, DH — S
6. Scott Sizemore — 2B — R
7. Brandon Inge — 3B — R
8. Gerald Laird — C — R
9. Ramon Santiago- SS- L- with Greinke starting. I’d Never, ever let Everett bat against a RHP, Ever.
So your saying you dont.....
….think jackson should be in CF but Sizemore is ready for 2b?……whats your reasoning for one rookie over the other?
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
Sizemore has been MLB ready for a while, the only reason he hasn’t gotten a chance was Polonco. Reports are that Jackson is not MLB ready, his AAA batting average last year was inflated by a BABIP of .390 (!) and he has considerably less power than Sizemore and strikes out more than twice as often
Of course we really don't know
until we see them against major league pitching, Bennie. But generally speaking, I see players that are able to cut down their K rates and increase OBP rates from one level to the next as being those that adjust well to the major leagues. AJax doesn’t have the kind of K/ BB rate that you like to see in a lead off spot. But then again, neither did Granderson. Jackson, I think will be up and down I- 75 for much of the 2010 summer. I’d love to see him sustain a solid average at the major league level. If so, he can be a big contributor.
I think that both players will be given every opportunity to claim a starting spot on the roster in Lakeland this year, but I give Sizemore a better shot of making it than Jackson. I am concerned about Sizemore’s defense, and it’s unfair to expect that he’ll be anything like Polanco, but he improved in the field- at least cutting down on the E’s as the season progressed last year. Word from scouts was that he needed to work on turning the DP and work on his footwork around the bag. Ironically, that’s how he busted his ankle in the AFL, turning a DP ball. Another factor is that there aren’t many other options at 2B. If Santiago plays 2B, then we have Santiago and Everett in the same lineup. Ugh!
Oh im no saying
he should lead off im saying that some people want Wells over Ajax on the team and I cant understand what the difference is.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Rookies are to be viewed independent of other rookies. Just because one is ready doesn’t mean the other one is.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
"Without further adieu"?
Is that like “Geaux Saints”?
by NCDee on Feb 8, 2010 11:18 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Doh
Posting at 11 pm got me on that one!
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 8, 2010 1:20 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
my roster basically looks like Kurt's
except I’d take out Dlugach and put in Kelly (no, not just because I have a crush on him), since he’s lefty and can do both IF/OF.
Looking at this
I’m starting to come around on the let’s-bring-in-Johnny-Damon camp. One year only, though.
I agree....
….Damon in LF Jackson In CF and Guillen as DH and Raburn as suber sub.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 11:43 AM EST up reply actions
This is what I don't understand
Why is everyone putting Raburn as the super sub he will certainly be better than Austin Jackson and will most likely be better than Guillen. Just because Guillen gets paid more money does not mean that he should play.
by craggt on Feb 8, 2010 12:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Where ya gona play raburn?
he cant play center and neither can damon
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 2:31 PM EST up reply actions
Why can’t he play center? He’s done it before. I would rather have Raburn with worse defense in center than an AJax hitting .230 without power and striking out all the time, which is what I think is going to happen.
Well me too.....
……but no one knows what Akax will be hitting……he may hit better then we all think.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
Top Ten things I would not do with the Tiger lineup
10. Put a failed starting pitcher in the bullpen
9. Give AB’s to Clete Thomas over Raburn just because he bats left
8. Start Avila vs all RHP’s. Our catcher matches up with OUR pitcher, not theirs.
7. Bat Jackson lead off because of his speed. Check out the OBP, not the SB.
6. Put Guillen in LF because he wants to play in the field.
5. Let Magglio’s $ 15 million option vest for 2011
4. Start Santiago and Everett in the same lineup.
3. Put Nate in the rotation because he’s a lefty.
2. Put Willis in the rotation for ANY reason.
1. Let Everett bat against a RHP. Ever. Ever. Ever.
So your saying that even if Willis proves to effective again...
and the best pitcher for the 5th spot that he shouldn’t get it? And basically you’re saying that Everett isn’t the everyday SS for the Tigers?
(I agree with most of the things you say though. especially 9-6 and 3.)
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Exactly On Willis....
……I can say the say the same thing about Robertson but I wont…..if either pitches well they should get the 5th spot.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 8, 2010 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
Of course we want the best pitchers
in the rotation. That won’t be Willis, and a spot should not be given to Nate because he’s a lefty
And Everett should not play every day. Over 200 AB’s vs RHP’s last year. That’s over 200 managerial errors. Everett costs the team twice as many runs at the plate as he saves in the field.
I love Everett....
….I call him Mr Clutch or run saver…..Hes always getst he big hit and his defense saves runs…..Underated player for sure.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 9:16 AM EST up reply actions
he had some huge hits......
…..last season…..Opie is clutch baby!!!
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
I hope you're kidding bennie
We just cll him loser at my house
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
Kinda Sorta....
…..Have always liked his games since his minor league days in Boston……Plays hard and loves the game….Those are the guys I like best.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 8:21 PM EST up reply actions
I'm excited
now that that Super Bowl thing is over that means we’re that much closer to Greinke/Verlander on Opening Day. Woo and hoo.
That's all right--we're okay with that . . .
. . .if that’s the way your really talk, that is.
by rea on Feb 8, 2010 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
Fun, but...
I would prefer to hold off on submitting my roster until after the Tigers have signed Johnny Damon and traded Bobby Seay.
To do otherwise would be too disheartening. Too many right handed bats… too many fourth outfielders… too many left handed relievers.
Matt Millen's MMA Promoter
Well...
Damon may not be an impact outfielder from a defensive standpoint, but I would have a hard time accepting an argument that the Tigers wouldn’t benefit from having someone of his batting caliber (hitting for average, plate discipline, taking walks, fouling off balls, gap power, and all from the left side of the plate) in the lineup for one year.
Matt Millen's MMA Promoter
The assumption...
…is that homerun power in the new Yankee Stadium will equal gap power in CoPa. I should have clarified that in my earlier reply.
Matt Millen's MMA Promoter
Opening Day Lineup (maker)
What really matters is whether or not the Tigers are saddled by the lineup writing bozo in the dugout on Opening Day. I’m referring to Mr. Blowing Smoke and Pennants, James Leyland himself.
Get rid of JL and his staff… tell DD to take a hike, and give Kaline his chance to run this team… GM and Manager, all at once.
I will pass on the notion of Kaline running the team. I think I’d probably rather have Randy Smith back. Old time players rarely are good at running a team or coaching.
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Now I write at Bless You Boys.
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by Mike Rogers on Feb 8, 2010 6:55 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I may be the one of the only.....
….people that thinks Ajax will be fine in CF…..I think he plays Cf and hits 9th and has a great rookie season.
2010 Baseball
I’m seeing a lot of RH on the starters. I don’t know if this will give the variety we’ll need but the interesting part is that our team’s closers are like any comparison having lots of different speeds and control.
Git 'r' done
RH starters
I wonder if this is why we go with 4 lefties in the pen- if you have a bunch of right-handers starting, you can neutralize your opponents lineups out of the bullpen. Not sure it makes complete tactical sense, but it’s a thought.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
FWIW
Here’s Baseball Prospectus’ projected stats for our 2 rookies:
Sizemore (age 25): 537 PA, 66 runs, 27 2B, 11 HR, 45 RBI, 11 SB, .263/.347/.401
AJax (age 23): 522 PA, 63 runs, 28 2B, 9 HR, 47 RBI, 13 SB, .270/.334/.413
They project them to be pretty close to the same guy. Now the question of whether a CF who hits like a second baseman is a good one, but everyone has to remember that Austin Jackson is, and has always been YOUNG for his level of competition. He was one of the youngest guys in AAA last year (7th youngest) and just turned 23 a few days ago. Granderson spent his age 23 season in AA and didn’t really break into the majors until his age 25 season.
All that said, I’d like them to bring Johnny Damon in to take away any temptation to lead AJax off.
What?
Is baseball prospectus off it’s rocker?
AJax only hit 4 home runs in 504AB in AAA, now he’s supposed to hit 9HR in the majors with half of his games at Comerica? They’re also predicted an OBP 64 points higher than his BA while the difference in AAA was only 54 points and a higher slugging percentage than in AAA? I mean that would be great but I just can’t see it. There essentially predicted that AJax is going to do essentially exactly the same overall in the MLB as he did in AAA (.747 OPS vs .759) while they’re predicting a drop for Sizemore from .851 to .748. Why is Sizemore dropping 103 points while AJax only loses 12?
I really have no idea how well either will do but I just don’t understand the rational for what they’re expecting.
I disagree with PECOTA
I’ll be getting the book later this week, but that just doesn’t look right. Jackson’s BABIP was sky-high last year, and his secondary skills aren’t quite there yet.
I’m also wondering if Sizemore is being punished for his injury- something’s off, because that line is the worst I’ve seen for him.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
PECOTA typically has trouble
in projecting guys who haven’t played in MLB. Remember their Wieters projection from last year?
Ah, Wieters
This is true.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
by David Tokarz on Feb 9, 2010 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
BABIP
Jackson does have a skill set that leads to consistently high BABIP…. without looking it up, i am pretty sure that he posted mostly BABIP’s of .350 or higher in the minors…
If you think the PECOTA is nice for Jackson, check out the Bill James projection for him on fangraphs.com… It was even sited in an article on that site about crazy projections for rookies…
Disagree. People have said he’s got above-average speed but guys that post very high BABIP’s are big time burners or guys that hit the baseball with authority (and hit a lot of LD’s) theoretically.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Here's the numbers
He overperformed in 2009 on LD’s, though his BABIP has always been a little high.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
by David Tokarz on Feb 11, 2010 6:39 PM EST up reply actions
There is a lot of measurement error in the minors when it comes to scoring
line drives. So, I’m not sure how much weight I would give to the line drive numbers. He is a ground ball hitter and that will boost his BABIP. It hurts his power numbers, though.
CHONE projects .255/.323/.389 for Sizemore and .265/.320/.387 for Jackson. Also 8 HR’s for Sizemore and 6 for Jackson.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
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Hank Blalock
Not saying I want the Tigers to sign him, far from it, but thought I’d throw it out there that he bats lefthanded. If he could handle third, which is apparently a big if, he might be of some help.
Armando
What do you think will happen to him if he does not make the rotation?
Also, I think it would be fun to have a poll about who will be the #5 starter
I think he has a minor leagu option left.
My Music: Now on last.fm!!
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
So when Sizemore struggles do we send him down.....
…..Like Ajax or does he have a longer rope???? I dont think he will…..I think if Sizemore struggles he will go down just like Ajax would.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 10:10 AM EST reply actions
You have to give Sizemore a longer rope I think.
They’ve already handed the position over to the kid, they’d better be willing to handle some growing pains.
My Music: Now on last.fm!!
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
Do you think......
…..that if sizemore is hitting .200 in may that he should continue to start?
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
Hypothetically, no
but…who exactly is going to play 2B then? Santiago? Then you’re asking Everett to play every day (remember, he only played 118 games last year). This is why former St. John’s point guard Felipe Lopez might not be a bad free agent signing for this club, non-Johnny Damon division. Also, I don’t think Sizemore will be hitting .200 in May. The conventional wisdom is that his bat will play in MLB, if not his glove.
Yes that was hypothetical...
……but once we sign say Lopez I think if Sizemore struggles he can play everyday 2nd base.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
He's also 25
Jackson is 23- so Sizemore’s time is now. Give the kid a guaranteed three months- then panic.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
MY LINEUP GOES LIKE THIS-- WITHOUT SIGNING DAMON, LOPEZ, AND WELLS!
SP- VERLANDER {RP], BONDERMAN {RP}, PORCELLO {RP}, SCHERZER {RP}……..5TH SPOT IN THE ROTATION— ROBERTSON {LP}, GALARRAGA {RP}, WILLIS {RP} 1. SANTAIGO- {SS} SWITCH HITTER & EXCELLENT BUNTER 2. JACKSON- {CF}—R 3. MAGGS – {RF}—R 4. CABRERA- {1B}—R 5. GUILLEN- {DH}—L 6. RAYBURN- {LF}—R 7. INGE- {3B}-R 8. SIZEMORE- {2B}-R 9. LAIRD/AVILA- {C}-R/L
remember this years tigers must focus & discpline more on hitting in order to score run[offensively speaking]…the worst tiger last year was as far as, hitting goes[EVERETT]…I rest my case!
Actually...
….id give worst hitting tiger award to laird.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
Must be new at this blog commenting business . . .
. . . not to realize all caps is gross breach of etiquette.
Dear lord, please no Nate
I see the fifth starter coming down to Coke/Galarraga with the loser in the pen. I see Schlereth beating out Ni. I see no Nate whatsoever. I see Larish over Dlugach (unless Dlugach is seen as a better backup 3B than Larish).
If Damon (or another OF/DH type) comes in, I think he replaces AJax and Clete and Raburn split CF duties. Unless AJax tears up AAA for the first two months.
I agree....
…..When Robertson doesnt make the rotation he will be released…..We have to many lefties in the pen as it is……So Nate pulled a Willis also….Actually worser….One decent year and he got a huge contract and did nothing…..At least Willis had a 22 win season along the way.
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 9, 2010 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
comes down to spring training, ~30 games to be played which three pitchers bidding on the 5th spot in the rotation: Robertson , Galarraga, Willis depends on how they do in spring training- according, to era, wins / loses, walks allowed thats what i engage it by. Whoever is the winner thats the 5th starter!
I'm going to call it
Nate posts an ERA under 4.50 in 30 starts this year.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
So, are we the only ones in the front seats of the Nate Robertson Is Not Finished bandwagon?
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
I did write him into the rotation
I swear people do not want to admit he had friggen growths in his throwing elbow. What do they expect him to do with that going on?
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 9, 2010 4:57 PM EST up reply actions
I don't know
I’m not a doctor. But he is a) left-handed and b) alive, so anything is possible. But seriously, Tigers pitchers come up with some weird injuries, no? Bonderman’s thoracic thingy, Robertson’s growths, Zumaya’s exploding finger tendons. Is a simple Tommy John Surgery too much to ask for?
Bonderman was just riding Kenny Rogers' coattails on that
Seriously, how do the Tigers have two pitchers in two years have that injury?
Sold their soul for 2006, I swear to you.
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 9, 2010 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
Don't say that.
I want a mostly health year from our team.
Kurt might be right about selling the teams soul in 2006.
This
If you jinxed it, so help me…
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
I hate to act like I know these guys and/or am a psychologist
But he did seem to get real doughy and down on himself this last year (not that you have to be in great shape to throw a baseball or anything). His pitching style is one where all needs to be going right, body and mind, to succeed. He just doesn’t have that innocent idiocy of a Verlander who can brush off everything and just pitch. There is certainly no guarantee he can’t pitch like the guy who deserved a multi-year, $7 mill per deal again (and he did deserve it at the time). I’m betting against, though.
we're like the saber 3 musketeers on tigers issues
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 9, 2010 6:12 PM EST up reply actions
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Funny
Considering I’m the prospect guy… you think I’d have a tools fetish.
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
Can we make this like … a Ford Ranger and put Kurt in the little fold-down seat behind the two front seats?
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Room for one more?
I promise to stay on until at least the 15th of April.
Matt Millen's MMA Promoter
Nate will Have a Good Comeback.....
No, you are not the only ones….I think Nate & Bonderman will both have extremely good years. I think the Tigers have the best pitching staff (Starting & Relief) in the AL, and maybe all of Baseball.
by TigersFan1957 on Feb 9, 2010 10:40 PM EST up reply actions
I'm on board
Nate will bounce back like a rubber ping pong ball!!
by 77bestrookieclassever on Feb 11, 2010 7:24 AM EST up reply actions
I wrote Robertson into my lineup but I think I would prefer Galarraga. I don’t see why it is required to have a left handed pitcher in the lineup. That being said JL is a bit of a traditionalist so I’m betting whichever of Robertson/Willis has the better ST will get the spot
the tigers started with 5 righties last year
I just don’t think Galarraga will earn it, personally.
That and the contract issue could come up. It shouldn’t, but it could. Galarraga has one option remaining.
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 9, 2010 6:16 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, like Kurt mentions, I don’t think it’s a fact of needing a LHP in the rotation as much as it’s that I think Nate Rob will with the spot.
My old blog is Tigers By The Numbers.
Now I write at Bless You Boys.
Like music? See what I'm listening to at my Last.fm account.
Nate will be given a shot at the rotation
but I’d give Galarraga better odds of rebounding and winning 10- 12 games.
Nate was never more than a fourth starter or a .500 pitcher, although he could eat some innings. Even that would be welcome at this stage. The back end of the rotation is one place where the Tigers could easily see some improvement. Scherzer picking up 13 W’s to replace Edwin Jackson is highly questionable, IMO. Now, can we get these guys some more run support?
This Roster has 90 Losses Written All Over It!
I just do not see the possible upside. No sparks from the line-up expecting too much from washed-up or injured players. This team looks like a 1974 revamp!
20 bucks says we win at least 75
President, Vice President and Secretary of the Casey Crosby Fanclub.
No one else sees Coke in the rotation?
Given that Bobby Seay is awesome, and my Tiger, and I’ll kill everyone I see if he’s traded, isn’t that the best way to alleviate the OMGLefties of the pen? I know Leyland sees him in the bullpen, but doesn’t that just mean he’s going to start or play left field or something? If he outpitches Nate in the spring, I don’t see any way he’s not the fifth starter.
well, it's hard saying
I thought it would be a good idea. So did Dombrowski. but then Leyland said Coke would be in the bullpen and Dombrowski changed his tune.
Obviously it’s hard to take everything they say at face value, but I think I believe them on this one. I’d prefer he audition to start myself, for what it’s worth.
by Kurt Mensching on Feb 9, 2010 9:04 PM EST up reply actions
I think (or maybe hope) . . .
. . .it’s a bit more calcuated than that—Dombrowski reminding the Gang of 4 (Bonderman, Roberston, Willis and Gallarega) that the Tigers have other options, and Leyland reassuring them that they’re still the prime candidates (the famous “bad cop/good cop” routine applied to running a baseball team).
“then Leyland said Coke would be in the bullpen and Dombrowski changed his tune.”
I also would like Coke to get a shot, but
as Leyland said he only has so many innings to see what happens in sprint training to see what guys have but also make sure they are ready. I don’t think Coke will get the opportunity unless Gallaraga, Robertson, and Willis all stink. Which I think is very probable.
And I don't mean to sound like an ass
I’m just surprised to see that Bobby Seay is anyones Tiger.
Matt Millen's MMA Promoter
Personally I like him...
The man doesn’t really have any amazing stuff but gets the job done, especially with the Tigers. He just knows what he can do and he does it pretty well.
My Music: Now on last.fm!!
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
Although I'm hoping . . .
. . . he’ll turn out to be Baltimore’s Tiger . . . (I want Luke Scott)
I'm not saying that he's not good at what he does...
… but I’m also not paying my admission to CoPa with the hope that on that night I’ll be able to see Bobby Seay pitch two thirds of an inning in person.
Matt Millen's MMA Promoter
haha
agreed.
sorry theRPS, but you have to admit that you do have interesting taste. :)
My Music: Now on last.fm!!
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
I think that if....
….Larid and Everett can hit .250 this year it could result in 3 4 more wins this year at least……Sizemore and Ajax could cost us 3-4 though……Im all for the current tigers and I like them all….I think this will be the opening day lineup baring any signings….
1) Raburn LF
2) Sizemore 2B
3) Cabrera 1B
4) Ordonoez RF
5) Guillen DH
6) Inge 3B
7) Laird C
8) Everett SS
9) Ajax CF
by BennieBladesFan on Feb 10, 2010 2:12 PM EST reply actions
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