Magglio Ordonez 'always a Tiger' seems possible to me
by Kurt Mensching on Jul 27, 2010 1:26 PM EDT
in Detroit Tigers Analysis
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PrintFans of Magglio Ordonez are probably looking for some good news right about now. So I'll deliver some. I suspect he's going to be a Tiger again, and not just for one year, either.
The storyline about Ordonez's option was big last year. This season it seemed like a given he'd hit the required minimums for the option to kick in. He was healthy. He was hitting. There's no way you sit him in a division race. While 135 starts was no sure thing, 540 plate appearances seemed pretty much like a given.
And then his ankle said "no mas" on Saturday, likely costing him most of the final two months of the season. (Side note: I do not blame third-base coach Gene Lamont. Injuries happen. They are pretty random. That's baseball.)
Some scratch paper math for you. You can skip this part if you like. He's at 365 plate appearances through 84 games played. (The Tigers have played 98). So we'll call it 4.4 plate appearances a game. If he's back in six weeks, that's around Sept. 5. Eight weeks is more like Sept. 19. So he should get between 62 and 114 plate appearances. He definitely will not make it to 135 games started.
Long story short, the option will not kick in for $15 million in 2011. There is no buyout on it, either. So Sept. 26 very well could be the last time Maggs plays at Comerica Park in a Tigers uniform.
But as a I said, I'm here to bring some good news, not the scary stuff above. I really think he's going to sign a fresh contract with Detroit that keeps him in the D another two or three seasons.
Unfortunately for Ordonez, the fractured ankle will cost him money. However I think he'll get a favorable extension offer from Detroit and remain with the franchise. But I can't give you any reason for that other than "gut" and "That's the way the team operates."
I wouldn't be surprised to see a two-year deal with an option for a third season, with the package valued in the $18-$24 million range depending on the third year. Even given a bit of a step back due to aging, Ordonez should earn his keep in that range. Plus he's a very, very popular player with the fans, and keeping the paying customers happy is most definitely a good business decision.
It's not without some worry. The Tigers seem unwilling to set aside the designated hitter position for a, well, designated ... hitter. Imagine if they had made an offer to a player like Jim Thome, who is only getting on base 40 percent of the time and slugging huge numbers at a cost of $1.5 million to the Twins. I also feel like Brennan Boesch needs to play in right field on most days, rather than be flipped to left. And of course, Ordonez will be a 37-year-old coming off a fractured ankle injury.
Big picture: it feels like a deal the team could live with, the player will like and the fans will love. It's certainly not a given, but I do expect to see Ordonez in the Tigers uniform past this year.
Always a Tiger? Ordonez may not have started out as one, but he could sure finish up that way.
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I was just saying this the other day
And having Ordonez making 8 mil a year instead of 15-18 is a hell of a lot easier to swallow. (and this avoids signing Jayson Werth to a ridiculous contract, which I’m all for)
Tough call...
I’m torn on this. I like a one year deal with a second year option; could be talked into a straight up two year deal. But I don’t like dealing with Scott Boras, and I’d be pissed if he tried shopping Magglio around first.
Its the classic loyalty to players issue. Now Detroit has money to make a run at a Carl Crawford; do they reward Magglio for his service with a contract that may hinder the club in 2012? Or, do they just do both and hope fans order more pizza? As they say.. its not my money. My fear is that an aging OF / DH isn’t worth $9 mil on the open market.
If I’m Magglio, I pull a Kenny Rogers — fire Boras now, negotiate your own contract with Detroit for a 2 year deal (say 2 years, $16 million).
www.tigergeist.com
DD doesn't have any problem negotiating with Boras
So I don’t see what the problem is here.
Also, the Tigers could sign Magglio for 10 million a year, sign Carl Crawford, and not even break a sweat. (I’m not advocating them getting Crawford, but money is absolutely not an issue this offseason)
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I AM advocating that the Tiger sign Crawford, and if signing Ordonez hinders that, then it's adios Magglio.
As much as I love Magglio, I think it’s time to move on. It’s time for the Tigers to go out and sign the first highly sought after free agent during DD’s tenure in Detroit. Enough of the discounts and one or two year deals. Enough of the aging, cast aside veterans with health issues. I don’t doubt that DD chickens out and brings back Ordonez, or even that he over pays him. I think his value on the free agent market is not near $ 8 or 10 million. See Jermaine Dye, Bobby Abreu, etc. He could be a bargain for some team, but more likely Boras has him sitting on the free agent market in late January, looking for a team.
The Tigers need speed at the top of the batting order. They need, among other things, a No. 2 and a No. 3 hitter. They need more complete ball players that can hit, run, and field. Magglio is one outta three. They do need to replace his 20 HR and 100 RBI in the lineup, and I’m not sure even he can do that much. Crawford or Werth are better options.
I’m ready to move on from ALL of the pending free agents- Ordonez, Inge, Bonderman, Laird, Seay, and even a couple of the arb eligibles such as Miner and Zumaya.
I’m ready for the DD to take a bunch of that money that he’s wasted on bad contracts- $75 million coming off the payroll after the season, and get a couple of studs that can hit, run, and field, and another premium starting pitcher.
Crawford is good
very good. But he’s somewhat of a prima donna, I cant see the chemistry between him and the Tigers working. He reminds me of Milton Bradley or Hanley Ramirez. I don’t like his attitude.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
I think he's overrated
And his game won’t age well.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
this
Let the Yankees have him
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by rock n rye on Jul 27, 2010 2:50 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I'd rather have Hanley than "chemistry".
Chemistry comes from winning.
Ryan Raburn antagonist.
Scott Sizemore liberationist.
You cannot refute that Hanley is talented though.
Ryan Raburn antagonist.
Scott Sizemore liberationist.
oh god no
I’ve watched him play. He’s extremely talented. and quick.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
He's losing some of his range at SS.
Not surprising, though, given his size and the demands of SS. He could be moved over to 3B by the Marlins sometime in the future.
Ryan Raburn antagonist.
Scott Sizemore liberationist.
I just don't know if Werth is going to be......
Worth the money he’s going to get. He had injury problems before he came to Philly, and he’s really not that much better than Ordonez (if he gets as much as Bay, it’s likely to be 8-10 mil more than what Magglio will get annually). There are many other ways I can think of using that money than on Werth.
1. Javier Vazquez would be a nice upgrade
2. Adrian Beltre
3. Cliff Lee
Any of those guys would be a better use of that cash than Werth would.
I think I could come around on Crawford since he hasn’t turned 30 yet, plays an excellent LF, has tons of speed, and a little bit of power as well. As long as he doesn’t have any years like 2008 during the deal, I’d be totally cool with it. (.318 OBP……..ugh)
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Ooh
Think we could get both Vasquez and Beltre?
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Daniel Fields is better than you.
by David Tokarz on Jul 27, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I really do
Especially if they Yankees go crazy overpaying for Cliff Lee. I’d be ecstatic to have Vazquez as the 3rd or 4th starter (depending on how Porcello finishes out the year), and Detroit is definitely going to have the money if they miss out on Cliff.
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
What about Carl Pavano??
Seriously, he’s good and I’m tired of losing to him.
Addition through subtraction, right?
Subtract Pavano from Minnesota for our own good.
Granderson was my Tiger, then Sizemore, then Willis. Since they're all gone, I'm taking Raburn and hoping the pattern holds.
Vazquez already has vetoed a trade to Detroit once.
After the 2006 season, when the Tigers offered Joel Zumaya for him.
Seems ive heard??
Vazquez talked about retiring after this season???
not my money but!!!!!!!
I’d spend it. with about 77mil comming off im guessing they spend about 55 to 65mil rough guessing here 1) C Lee (17m) 2) C Crawford (15m) 3) Jorge DeLarosa ((10m ??) Maggs 9m and Inge 5m . No SS out there unless they make a trade id take Maggs and Inge over overpaying for Worth or Beltre. Lee and Jorge 2 lefties id really love esp vs. twins . biggest concern here is will Crawfords game (speed) last as long as his contract. I left a couple Million for fillers and a parade party
Jorge De La Rosa isn't very good
And I would never want Detroit to spend 10 million a year on him.
I’ll agree with Nick on Carl Pavano. I feel like an idiot for being nervous that he’d pull the stuff on us that he did with the Yankees, but that’s probably not valid.
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Boras
I agree DD doesn’t have a problem with Boras; I do. :)
Simply put, I’d like to see Magglio man up and tell Boras to suck it, negotiate with the Tigers for a ‘retirement’ deal. Once Boras parades Magglio around to all the clubs, the less excited I get about over-paying Magglio just for loyalty. But again, its not my money.
www.tigergeist.com
Concur...
But Boras is a prickly type and if a three yr deal is available anywhere but here, Maggs is highly unlikely to come back. Dumbrowski has made as many boneheaded moves as good ones so not sure what way this will all go.
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Michigan, Pistons, Wings, Tigers, Chargers 'til I die.
DD is always dealing with Boras
if not directly, through Mr. Illich. How do you think Damon got here? Tigers are one of the very few teams that WILL deal with him.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
It will be interesting
Unfortunately for Ordonez, the fractured ankle will cost him money. However I think he’ll get a favorable extension offer from Detroit and remain with the franchise. But I can’t give you any reason for that other than “gut” and “That’s the way the team operates.”
To me, it seems that there are some parallels between where Ordonez is this year and Polanco last year. They are both free agents, both were important parts of the Tiger’s return to respectability, and both are/were popular with the fans. Also, they are both free agents in a year where the Tigers seem likely to try and cut operating expenses and “get younger”.
Where they differ, in my mind, is that the organization seems to have found a much more viable replacement in RF this year than they did at 2B last year. Boesch should be playing RF not LF, especially since the Tigers are probably going to bring Strieby up to the big club sooner rather than later. This doesn’t mention Cletus, Casper, or any of the other young outfielders that are probably getting close to make-or-break time in the minors. The Tigers didn’t last year, and still don’t, have the same kind of minor league depth in the infield that they do in the outfield.
In fact, an argument can be made that we saw this pattern already play out with Pudge as well. The Tigers traded him rather than let him walk when they figured they weren’t going to be able to meet his contract demands.
With Boras as an agent, it’s just hard for me to imagine Ordonez taking much less than the max he could make from some other team who is closer to a World Series than the Tigers are. If some other team offers him a 3 year $30M deal, is he going to settle for a 3 year $22M deal to DH for the Tigers? Hard to imagine for me.
by Big Z in Orlando on Jul 27, 2010 2:03 PM EDT reply actions
I'd go further than what Kurt suggests
I’d even offer him 4 years, 30mm so he could retire in a Tigers uniform. That’s $7.5mm per year, which means if something happens, he doesn’t crush the payroll but it also gives him the length he wants.
Assist. Editor, Minor League Division, Bless You Boys
Daniel Fields is better than you.
But it's a low salary
And he’s said he wants to play 4 more.
Assist. Editor, Minor League Division, Bless You Boys
Daniel Fields is better than you.
by David Tokarz on Jul 27, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Lets start with 2 years, 15 mil
And put some team options in, how about that?
4 year deals for guys who are older than 35 are dumb.
Unless player in question is
One Barold Lamar Bonds.
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd be okay with options
But the length could seal the deal at a low price.
Assist. Editor, Minor League Division, Bless You Boys
Daniel Fields is better than you.
by David Tokarz on Jul 27, 2010 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions
I was talking about this very same thing with a friend
It’s not like he needs the money. He is in fact a very popular player in Detroit, one of the more popular. He does an enormous amount of philanthropy work throughout the city especially in Southwest Detroit. He is loved and adored in that area of the city along with fellow teammate Carlos Guillen.
I can see him staying and taking a lesser amount of money to stay because he loves us back (as much as we love him) I would feel more comfortable about him making a deal of sorts if he "switched’ agents. On the other hand, unlike other teams the Tigers do not seem to have a problem dealing with Boras.
Another reason I can picture him staying is Mr. Illich loves maggs. He is the one who negotiated the original contract and he also let him vest at a time when everyone thought they should cut Maggs loose. I can see Mr. Illich intervening again; especially when he loves a particular player.
However, I do think the $$ amount Kurt has, is a bit high, I would say 2 years at $11 – $12M with a 3rd yr option for about 4-5M. It will be interesting to see how things play out. I do think the organization realizes if they don’t pick up Maggs, someone else will. I am sure they would hate to see him back in the AL Central on an opposing team.
He is after all still, a very good hitter.
Nice strory, Kurt :) I like it.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
It's not as if it would be easy to replace Maggilo as it is...
He still has a very productive bat, and there’s no guarantee the Tigers could find someone comparable in free agency.
Sure, the Tigers will have a ton of payroll available, but they won’t be the only team looking to fill holes. And as much as I hate to say it, there are more attractive places to play than the city of Detroit.
If Dombrowski thinks Ordonez would be a productive offensive player for a couple more seasons, they should find a way to keep him. As long as it isn’t for $15M a season…
I'm owner/editor of The Wayne Fontes Experience a deputy editor at Bless You Boys and co-host The Knee Jerks podcast.
I dunno
Just as a fan, I’m kinda sick of watching the Tigers run out a team with what feels like half a dozen guys who probably should be DHing year-in-year-out.
On the other hand, he’s a popular player and if he can be had for cheap-ish there’s no reason I wouldn’t like to see him retire a Tiger. And hey, maybe he could be our DH!
Of course, that would entail finding some other players that aren’t Mudhens, and we don’t do that.
With those who don't give a damn about baseball, I can only sympathize. I do not resent them. I am even willing to concede that many of them are physically clean, good to their mothers and in favor of world peace. But while the game is on, I can't think of anything to say to them. ~ Art Hill
I don't know
He’s going to have an even harder time staying healthy. He broke his ankle because of his errant slide at home plate, so DH’ing him is still put him at risk for more injuries. We still got Guillen also.
I’d like to see this team move in another direction. I want to see us better defensively and better on the base paths, so I’m more down with going after Carl Crawford than anyone.
We got Boesch in RF, Jackson in CF, and LF we could try to sign Crawford, or bring back Damon. There’s even an outside shot that Casper Wells or Ryan Streiby will be ready for the show next season. Streiby won’t help us defensively, but he could be a guy that we’d want to DH and play the outfield occasionally.
why would you bring back Damon?
Not saying I don’t like Damon, because i do a lot. But Why would you bring him back, when he’s a little older than Magglio and about half the hitter Magglio is. I mean if you could Damon or Maggs for the same $$ amount, wouldn’t you go with the player who’s a better bat? I would.
The only thing Damon has better numbers than Maggs is Runs and Hits (but he’s also played in the majors 3 years longer) in maggs career he’s got over 200 more RBI and less strikeouts Damon does. Career strikeouts for Damon 1096 – - Career strikeouts for Maggs 812. Just sayin’
in Damon’s time here he’s played almost as many games ans maggs and driven in half the runs. I also find it interesting that maggs has 59 RBI on the season and Damon has been driven in how many times? you guessed it, 59. I know he wasn’t drivne in by Ordonez on each one of those runs, but i do think its amusing how those numbers are the same.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
RBI are not a good indicator of talent.
RBI come from situations and place in batting order. Damon has hit lead off most of his career, not exactly a position ripe with RBI opportunities.
Damon is about 1 year older than Magglio but is less of an injury concern and has a bit more range in the OF, though his noodle arm is a big negative. Damon was brought up by KC at 21, Magglio at 23 by Chicago. He’s been more durable. I’d probably sign Magglio over Damon because of utility (it’s easier improving over Damon than it is Magglio). However, truth be told, I’d rather go younger.
Opportunities to drive in runs are more about situations and batting order than personal ability, you cannot fairly use that as an indicator of ability.
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I'd take Crawford or Werth over either of them.
But why are we talking about keeping eitherOrdones OR Damon?
There’s $ 75 million coming off the payroll fer krissakes! The Tigers can keep both, keep one and sign another $ 8 to 15 million man, or sign two guys for $ 23 million and not pay a dime more than they’re paying now! Throw in Bonderman’s money, and Robertson’s, and Willis’s,- now sign Lee and Crawford!
you forgot the squiggly
(removing tongue from cheek and wiping mischievous smirk off face now)
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I'll deal with you another time...
P-A-R-T-H-A ( no squiggly) :)
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
Because there's no guarantee Crawford will sign in Detroit
and Werth may get much more $ than his true worth. Obviously, Crawford worth spending big money on…but FA doesn’t happen in a vacuum, there are other teams willing to spend as well.
Ordonez would be a nice fall back option.
I'm owner/editor of The Wayne Fontes Experience a deputy editor at Bless You Boys and co-host The Knee Jerks podcast.
maybe not
I don’t know. I think it would depend on who you ask. i think they are, maybe I’m wrong. Strike out ratio is a good indicator. And If I ma the GM of a team or I am the guy making the lineup, doing the buying or whatever, I am looking at both of those numbers, as well as a few others. I’m gonna pit the guy in the line up with 200 more rbi and 400 less strike outs. That tells me, he’s got a good eye and knows how to find the gap.
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
Damon is a table setter. Magglio is a slugger. Both are seeing power declining.
RBI is not a good measure for a no. 1 or 2 hitter. They simply don’t come up with nearly as many men on base. That’s especially true with the bottom of the order that the Tigers have had during Damon’s time. Damon is not a No. 3 hitter, and shouldn’t be in that spot now, either.
As for strikeouts, all the career leaders in strikeouts are in the hall of fame. I look at K/ BB rates for minor leaguers to see if they show any plate discipline, but I don’t worry about K rates in general. In a lead off hitter, or No. 2 hitter, yes. They have to make contact.
Or he bats with guys on base more often.
RBI really tells you nothing about a player’s ability. There’s way too many variables involved.
Damon is less of an injury risk, he's a left-handed bat, plays better defense,
can play CF in an emergency, can run the bases better, has a good OBP, he’s out there helping the rookies develop, he’s taking a leadership position, and he’s the team spokesman.
I love Magglio to death, but I think Damon brings more to the table.
I will be sad to see Ordonez leave
I won’t shed a tear for Damon though.
Plays better defense??
i dont think so. plus his arm was a transplant from a 89 year old corps.
I understand there is sentimental value,
but I don’t want to watch Magglio struggle again. I have many great memories of him helping this team, and I want to see him leave on a high note. If he’s here a few more years, we’ll likely see him struggle again and possibly get run out of town by the same hard nosed critics that didn’t want his option to vest last season.
He wasn't struggling this season though
And I don’t think he’d be run out of town if he was performing poorly, because the money involved would be completely different.
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
maggs will not stay on the team for less than $15M a year
just one man’s guess, but i don’t see maggs coming back for less money. i see him very much going to another team, even if the money is equal.
this is going to be drawn out and unfriendly.
I don't think so.
I think he realizes no one will pick him up for 15M a season. He’s getting older
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
not a team in baseball would give him 15m for a season
by Kurt Mensching on Jul 27, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
that was another discussion I had today
yes I think after this season there’s a possibility. With just one year left on his contract — which seems to be the magic time for them — and his complete inability to play a season without multiple injuries, they won’t let him get in the way of a good plan.
by Kurt Mensching on Jul 27, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Where is this "good plan" of which you speak?
- Nothing on the farm
- Little or nothing available on the free agent market for the infield
- Is DD going to sign Crawford and Lee?
DD isn't signing crawford or lee
yankees might sign both
by redwingxviii on Jul 27, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
I know NY loves throwing around cash but
They still have to resign Jeter and Rivera too I think
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 4:05 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I could see Jeter taking less money for the team
and Rivera retiring, especially if the Yankees win it.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
The Yanks would have to make room for Crawford
I don’t see them moving Brett Gardner and they are already on the hook with Granderson and Swisher.
I welcome all shit talkers but
Forget Werth who cannot hit outside of that sandbox in Philly. His average with RISP is also pretty lame.
Sign Crawford, yes you will pay a shit ton of cash for CC but we need him and he will be worth it.
As for Lee… They need to just get that done too. Something about Verlander/Lee/Scherzer gets me happy downstairs.
Will it happen? Probably not but I’d even take three more years of Cringe and another catcher that can’t hit if we could get that done.
The real question for me is who they will target at SS? Not to many high profile names there.
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 4:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Lee won't happen, he's going to NY
You can book that. I agree on Werth though, I don’t think he will do well in the CoPa at all.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Not really
It shows how unclutch that the bearded fella is
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 4:12 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
No it doesn't.
RISP= batting average with runners in “scoring position”
First of all, it’s batting average. A single is the same as a home run, a sac fly means nothing, moving the runner up means nothing, a walk means nothing, a double that scores the runner from first means nothing, a two run homer with a man on first doesn’t count at all….
but an infield single that moves the runner from second to third increases the batter’s RISP.
Lame statistic.
Arguing over the Internet = lame
I’ll just agree to disagree Tiger Dog One
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 4:48 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Half the posts on here would be lame, then?
Besides, RISP is nothing more than what the Japanese call a speech impediment.
by Tigerdog1 on Jul 27, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
No matter how lame you think it is
The Tigers suck at it worse than most teams (see the motto) and it’s something that would lead to more wins if we increased our productivity in those situations. We need a situational hitter who can poke one to the opposite field.
I posted a Fan post on this topic over there>>>>>>>>>>>>
RISP is very, very limited. The limitation starts with using batting average, when there are many other, better measures of offensive performance.
AGREE agree agree with JAYRC
now throw in DeLarossa and u got my vote for GM
of course no team is giving him 15M
but i’m guessing that Maggs isn’t going to have some friendly reaction to us declining his option. it’s expected, obviously, but i believe he will have a negative reaction anyway. and then it will turn into “screw you, i’ll find some other team that values me”
and he’ll get a lot less money to play there, but it will make sense in his mind
by redwingxviii on Jul 27, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Maggs isn't going to throw a hissy fit over it
And I doubt the Tigers will just decline it without renegotiating another deal with him. I don’t see them pulling a cut-and-run type deal, especially after letting him vest last year and seeing what production that brought on this season.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Boras will hold out, hold out, hold out, and hold out.
Then he’ll do a Damon/ Abreu type of deal.
But if Magglio wants Boras to do anything other than get the most money, and the highest commission, he’ll have to personally intervene, and maybe fire Boras.
Regardless
Magglio isn’t going to throw a hissy fit if the Tigers don’t give him the $15 million option, like redwing suggested. Obviously Boras is a douchebag, but I have faith in DD being able to deal with him.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions
last year
remember last year when the tigers sat a slumping maggs and there was the possibility that he wasn’t going to get enough ABs? i know maggs took the high road publicly, but maggs did hire his agent for a reason.
remember damon this past off-season? “i will not take a pay cut”
it’s just my guess that maggs isn’t going to be thrilled to take a pay cut to stay in detroit. i like maggs and i’m not saying he’s a bad guy or going to throw a “hissy fit”
i’m saying that if i lost my option, i’m not going up to my employer with a big smile saying “let’s pay me something closer to market” and furthermore, i’m saying that it would be easier to “start over with a new company with a chip on my shoulder (pretty much like damon did)”
happens all the time
by redwingxviii on Jul 27, 2010 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions
No one will pay him $15 million
Maggs would be an idiot to not realize that (sorry Patti).
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions
mags for 4 years
at 7.5 mil to DH I’d be all for it I also think he’ll be productive the whole time unlike Guillen
As a full time DH
I’d go a 4 year deal… but if he’s expected to be playing outfield, I wouldn’t give him that long a deal
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by Lester A. Wiltfong Jr. on Jul 27, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions
I understand the emotional tie to Magglio, but a quick look at the 2011 FA class shows that there are much better options than him available.
Great article & I hope that you are right kurt
Without getting into all of my offseason wishes…
I hope we see Maggs back in Detroit. Even if it is at $10 MM to $12 MM a year for two or three more seasons. The extra 3-5 MM would help with arbitratration on some of the lil fellas and it would provide even more cash to plug our needs.
3B SS C LF and a SP is a lot but having over $65MM + per season to get it done is encouraging!
Great article, fingers crossed that yet another authentic jersey will not be pushed to the back of the closet.
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 3:56 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
What about Bondo?
What would be a good deal (for the tigers) for Bonderman? He will never live up to the hype of his early career, but he could be had for a reasonable deal. I’d rather have him then go after a pitcher with similar skills – the devil you know rather than the devil you don’t. Would 2 yrs and $12 total get it done?
I'd do 2/10
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Daniel Fields is better than you.
by David Tokarz on Jul 27, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
You could do worse as a 5th starter
Assist. Editor, Minor League Division, Bless You Boys
Daniel Fields is better than you.
by David Tokarz on Jul 27, 2010 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I think he has some trade value
I’d shop him around a bit
B.Inge's facial hair advisor
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Kurt
How much are you assuming he’d get in arbitration?
Are you assuming the Tigers’ offer would be the best offer, or that Maggs would overrule Boras at some point in the decision making process?
by Dergunna Wavimin on Jul 27, 2010 4:32 PM EDT reply actions
He could get anywhere from 13-20 mil in arbitration
Not worth it.
In regards to bondo & SP
There really isn’t that many arms that raise an eyebrow though. This is a pretty weak free agent class.
Beyond Lee and Lilly there Really ain’t much!There is Petite, Pavano and Kuroda who will likely resign. Westbrook, Padilla and Penny. Then the often injured Harden and Webb remain.
Say what you will, I almost see them bringing Bondo back. I know I’d take him over Armando. Sorry JMO
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 4:35 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Don't forget about
Javier Vazquez and Ben Sheets.
I think that Bonderman will probably get more interest than we think. He’s going to be the youngest guy on the market, is still putting up good peripherals, and might look really nice to an NL team with a big park.
by ozymandius1024 on Jul 27, 2010 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Thanks I forgot about those two
I think sheets is pretty much finished.
I agree though on bondo. I guess what I was trying to say is because the market is pretty weak, all the free agents values are increased. They all will be over payed again but even more so because of the lack of availible arms on the market.
by JAYRC on Jul 27, 2010 4:56 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
also dont forget
Jorge De Larosa IMO he’ll be the 2nd best FA starter. am i the only one who likes him ? i never see any mention about him .
Yes
You are the only one that likes him.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions
His mom is glad someone likes him.
It means she can stop pretending.
Ryan Raburn antagonist.
Scott Sizemore liberationist.
Dude's got a 5.21 career ERA
and a K/BB ratio under 2. He sucks.
by handsomerob1 on Jul 27, 2010 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Magglio won't be offered arbitration...
The criteria in arbitration is different than it is on the free agent market.
The criteria includes salary history, and what a player of like experience and performance makes. In arbitration, experience is valued much more. In free agency, a player’s age works against him. Boras would make the case that there’s no reason to believe that a broken ankle wouldn’t be fully healed. Magglio would almost certainly accept arbitration, giving his agent more leverage in contract negotiations with the Tigers.
That was one thing I was trying to clear up
Is arbitration an option? With salary history being a big part of it would that make is arb number somewhere between $13-17mil? In that case, I’d assume arbitration would not be an option. Eddie Bajak’s numbers say Maggs is a “B”, by the way.
I think Maggs and Boras have more to do with whether Maggs ends up on the Tigers next year than the way the Tigers operate does. Boras will simply take the biggest offer. I think 3 years, $30 million is out there somewhere. For the Tigers to get noticed, Maggs is going to have to outright tell Boras to make a deal with DD. I just don’t think that’s going to happen.
by Dergunna Wavimin on Jul 28, 2010 8:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Tigers Need a Geriatric Medical Specialist
To keep Guillen, Damon and Ordonez in the line-up!
cabrera isn’t my tiger anymore,100% of the time when the is on the line 9th inning base full one out and as usual either hit into the doubleplay or ground tothe 3rd out or strikeout if never fails and 12 hit the tigers had and this lost the game with TB only had 4 or 5 hits, and the tigers stranded a total of 14 left on base…….I am piss!
by '' spiderman '' on Jul 27, 2010 10:13 PM EDT reply actions
seriously?
http://www.fangraphs.com/statsplits.aspx?playerid=1744&position=1B/3B/OF&season=2010
look at the stats in High Leverage situations and tell me that Miguel always grounds out
Blatant Twitter Promotion
Cabrera is
a career .443 hitter with RISP. so whatever spiderdude
Welcome to Detroit, NO sissies allowed
by Detroitchik on Jul 27, 2010 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions
now I am turning to NFL…….too bad for verlander he pitched well of to win, if verlander can’t win nobody can, that the season…………….I have to wait another year to see the tiger, oh well, it was what it is, tigers are H O R R I B L E simple is that!
by '' spiderman '' on Jul 27, 2010 10:20 PM EDT reply actions
Please stick around, Spidey!
I’d like to see more gloom and doom. Plus, it’s fun to interact with fans that bail 60 games early. (How does that sarcasm font work?)
Granderson was my Tiger, then Sizemore, then Willis. Since they're all gone, I'm taking Raburn and hoping the pattern holds.
New Faces for Tigers!
Tigers need power hitters at least two Good power hitters and power hitter 3rd base hitter like Washington has and the Tigers has the money, then spend it wisely and no more money on all these Old ball players for next year. They can have some good "FREE AGENTS’ if they want to win before there ACE pitchers Verlander and Max get too old, now is time to get the POWER HITTERS IN THE FREE AGENTS,NOT THREE YEARS FROM NOW.
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