All season I enjoyed watching a game with BYB Friends. The playoffs...not so much
I really enjoyed a summer of logging on to BYB and enjoying a baseball game with Tiger Fans all over the State and the Country for that matter. Sure it got raucous at times and as much as the next guy, I threw a number of barbs at Leyland, Lamont, Legendary Lloyd, Brandon, Brad and Ryan. It was usually deserved and we all took out our frustration with a keyboard. But Saturday night there was a new dynamic at work in here and I didn't like it. At one point someone asked "Why does it feel we are behind 5-0, when it's actually tied". I think that was the quote. My response was "It feels this way because of all the negativity in the room". Two or three folks agreed with me.
Yesterday I stayed away. First it was because I didn't want to "jinx" the boys by coming in late, but I was probably late for a reason. I wanted to ENJOY the game, and Saturday night wasn't fun....and it wasn't just because of the game.
People were cursing every at bat and making absurb points. One attacked Magglio, calling him Singlio or some other equally witty name, for the hit and run that turned into a double play. It was perfect execution on the part of the Yankees because Cano left to cover the bag and Magglio's hit was right to him. Others were constantly bitching about first pitch swinging, and some were bitching when we didn't swing at the first pitch. I should have shut her down an hour before I did. Go back and read the threads if you disagree with me. In one thread moderators warned people about personal attacks and I had never seen that happen before.
Is it because we have a number of NEW BYB Fans here?
Were fans from other boards popping in and out just to criticize?
Was it like this in game 163 in 2009?
I'll be back tonight cause I always love to watch the threads when Justin Verlander pitches. However, if every other comment is bitching about every Tiger at bat. I'll just quietly watch the way I used to.
I know. I know, I sound like a whiny old woman, but I don't give a shit. ! I don't care if you call for Leyland's head ( I did back in May), and criticize Ryan Raburn's defense. Scream all you want after Brandon strikes out. But calling out Miggy for strike three, and bitching about almost every plate appearance is not only stupid it becomes offesive. Don't jump on every pitch as if is two outs in the end of the 9th. There was a lot of baseball to go Saturday night yet it seemed like the guys were on the brink of elimination.
I'm interested in knowing if I am being a "grumpy old fart" or if the mood was difficult for others Saturday night. "Bless You Boys" has been such a terrific place to celebrate the Detroit Tigers, I just hope it continues. I don't think we have to drink Kool-Aid and sing Cumbaya together but we CAN enjoy the game, together, without rancor and stupid inane comments that simply piss off real fans, and the guys that have been here a while.
OK, I am off my soap box. If I'm wrong let me have it tonight! GO Tigers!
JB
PS: Kurt and the Moderator Gang - If you hate this and think it inappropriate feel free to delete the Fanpost. watched a ton of games this season with the BYB gang
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the Bless You Boys writing staff.
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I didn't read the threads during either game
The stakes are much higher. We all get so invested in this team that a playoff game can be very frustrating if/when the bad guys win. I’m guessing that winning game threads are much happier places than losing threads and the playoffs only amplify that.
I suppose it’s good advice to remember that every member of this team (and coaches) played a big role in a dozen or more of our wins. (And a handful of guys can claim a whole lot more than a dozen.) It’s our team and we should support them in good times and bad (which applies to a game and a season as much as decade to decade). I don’t think that means you can’t get frustrated or even verbally state as much…that’s what makes us great fans instead of casual observers.
And I’ll say this: Yankee ball has a way of bringing out the worst in people. Seeing them work the count and pounding balls when they get the count in their favor is not fun.
Let hope for a relaxing game tonight from Verlander and stay classy when things don’t go our way.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
I think it was a general freakout
We were irritated that Detroit didn’t annihilate Garcia and near the end, we lost it.
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
I think part of it is new people
part of it is grouchy people, and part of it is people like David where it’s almost an act and you just have to have the context to realize that and roll with it.
Almost an act?
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
Yeah, Kurt, you're talking about the kid who is afraid of his pillow
or probably something just as ridiculous.
I'm not this much of a Debbie Downer
Say once that the Tigers are the worst playoff team in the AL and people tear into you… never mind that being the worst playoff team is like being the least awesome Avenger. Sure, Hawkeye’s useless… but he’s got a FREAKING BOW AND ARROW.
Where was I?
*end nerd rant
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
Boston got criminally unlucky
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
by David Tokarz on Oct 3, 2011 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions
If they had any pitching depth at all, they maybe could have trotted someone better than Andrew Miller out there as a replacement for Buchholz (who – let’s face it – had crappy peripherals this year anyway). I have to think that even the Tigers, who aren’t known for having great organizational depth, could have pulled something better out of the aether.
At any rate, you can’t entirely blame injuries for playing .200 ball in September against a schedule with an awful lot of cupcakes. That sounds more like horrible conditioning or certain overachieving players (Gonzalez and his ridiculous BABIP luck all freaking season – .380 for an ungodly slow player like him makes AJax look like he was underachieving last year; Beckett and his 1 run FIP-ERA difference) coming back to Earth.
In one case (Ellsbury) he never did come back to Earth – maybe he never will, but I’m still skeptical about the sustainability of some banjo hitter with 17 homers in his last two seasons combined coming in with 32 this year. Not accusing steroids here by any means, just ridiculous luck.
Let’s face it: they had a ton of breaks go their way this year to be up by 9 games in September in the first place.
Go look at run differential and third order winning percentage
That was a well constructed ballclub that got screwed down the stretch.
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
Boston's rotation was just flat out bad down the stretch
and they had depth. Theo planned for having issues in the rotation, but every starting pitcher that they added was lousy. The Yanks got solid seasons out of retreads like Freddy Garcia and Bartolo Colon when Burnett and Hughes let them down. But Boston had every pitcher in their rotation save for Beckett go in the tank and all the replacements- guys like Miller and Bedard- didn’t step up for them.
This leads right into the job that DD did with the Tigers this year. I wrote early on that the Tigers had a big advantage in payroll flexibility because the Twins and White Sox had over extended themselves on payroll. Chicago sold Edwin for a relief pitcher at the deadline (and let Colby Rasmus go to Toronto when they could have had him for Edwin). DD landed an outfielder, a starting pitcher, and essentially got the 7th inning reliever with Coke going back to the pen. I believe it was very much by design that he had some flexibility going in to make those moves. Boston added the depth but it didn’t work for them. It worked for Detroit and New York, but I think the Yanks will be exposed in the playoffs while the Tigers will ride Fister to the LCS.
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
Their a bunch of drunks
Did you guys ever see that music video,""Hell Yeah, I Like Beer", that has Beckett, Buchholtz, Wake, and Lackey?
LINK
"Because we've got Justin Verlander and you don't." -BYB
I would say it's the playoffs
I look at the PA threads and I see a lot of that as well. Both fanbases are or have been so confident in their teams that when things don’t go perfectly, they start to freak out. I think the freak out also has to do with fear, conscious or sub conscious, of the other team – “We HAVE to do perfectly or they’re going to capitalize on every mistake!” Unfortunately, stress leads people to unpalatable reactions. I don’t blame you if you don’t want to expose yourself to that as you watch a game.
I'm not reading threads
in real time either for my own sanity.
Although, there’s a great post in Pinstripe Alley today about A-Rod choking away the postseason again. The fans there are definitely restless, worse that what I’ve generally seen here.
If someone could start a game 3 thread just for the Kool-Aid drinkers
That’s where I’d be. Nothing I hate more than reading the F word a thousand times on the game threads.
I agree with you
I was really looking forward to joining the game thread and participating a little bit, I haven’t had the time to do so much the last month or so. Then every ball that a tiger pitcher threw was followed by a post all in caps it seemed like and it just wasn’t fun.
I understand that playoffs are a more stressful time for us fans and we want everything to go well. I also understand that some of it could have been an act. or just following the prevailing mood of the thread. Unfortunately, for me, it ruined a nice place I like to go that I can get excited and still have an intelligent baseball discussion/argument with Tiger fans. A little more emotion is understandable in these situations, and a few more curse words or a couple caps posts are expected and understood, but it was out of hand Saturday in my opinion.
i'll tell you though, it used to be worse
I just about gave up on BYB after the first season. There was a lot of negativity, and if I tried to police it to make it a more enjoyable place I took a lot of crap from people who wanted it to be more like other sites they frequent.
BYB is BYB. We’re not as permissive as some, not as tight as others, not as positive as we could be, not nearly as negative as it sometimes comes off.
by Kurt Mensching on Oct 3, 2011 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I feel the same way about the Lions threads too.
The last two games the first halfs have been brutal. Some people seem to be happy when the Lions screw up so they can say “I told you so” and Same Old Lions. I never felt that way on the BYB game threads. But I always thought that is the difference between baseball and football fans.
I have really enjoyed the game threads here on BYB during the regular season. I am not a long time visitor to this site, but I found the discussion to be generally relaxed, playful, and funny as hell. Now I can’t say much about the playoffs as I have barely been on, but is it mostly due to the higher level of pressure of being in the playoffs and against the hated Yankees?
Well, I hate the Yankees. I don’t know about the rest of you.
"Filling a need doesn’t necessarily mean you’re getting a good player," said Schwartz. "It doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re getting a player that best fits; it doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re getting a player that’s better than what you have already."
I've just become a recent poster
And have only been reading game day threads since the playoffs, looking for people to share my excitement with.
It did seem like a lot of negativity. I know not everyone is the same type of fan, but I’m a Tiger through and through, and I cheer for the Tigers until the last out.
Like the Lions game yesterday, sometimes epic things happen. I’m down here in Texas and I yell at the TV, throw fist pumps, scream and cuss, stand up and clap whether I’m watching the game on TV (mostly mlb.tv) or at a game in person, or even listening to blacked out games. And that can be much more fun when surrounded by people who are just as excited (even if it’s just online forums).
So yeah, a little bummed about the negativity during game day threads.
I think it's a mix of a lot of things
Many of the regulars are being much more negative because there is way more at stake with every pitch. On the other hand, many of the new posters aren’t helping this vibe. Some of the personal attacks we’ve seen are from newer posters who are either on edge or still aren’t quite familiar with the BYB guidelines.
I really noticed that the negativity started to compound on itself as yesterday’s game went on. Sadly, I think it will be even worse with JV on the mound tonight. Even during the regular season, it seemed like the sky was falling if JV gave up a run or two early on. I wish the playoff threads weren’t like this, but I guarantee that it won’t be this negative come the start of next season.
I'm sorry you feel that way
but I can’t say I disagree… it’s become a little different during the playoffs. That said, I pretty much agree what’s already been stated. I think it’s just a combination of people being on edge because the stakes are so much higher, and new posters not really familiar with how BYB works yet.
If you are around tonight, hope you feel like chiming in! Always a great night when JV takes the mound.
No longer the Founder, President and CEO of the Ryan Raburn Fan Club
I guess it's a matter of preference...
I’ve been posting here a while, a discussion I had in a thread recently, and I ended up getting called an established vet around these parts so maybe my two cents will have some weight.
I’ve posted here through good seasons and bad seasons. Great games and collapses. No hitters, perfect games, unmentionable games (for God knows how many overflow threads), and all the other stuff in between. All I can say is maybe this place is like a bar. You show up during any other day and you can see your regular group there and have a good old time watching baseball. Occasionally a new face pops up and he either fits in or you haze them away.
Playoffs are another monster. You go to your favorite bar, try to sit in your favorite spot, and all of sudden, everybody in town wants to watch ball and drink. “Might be fun” you say to yourself, but the whole experience is going to be off. Everything is louder. You can’t hear the game as well. People are swearing at the TV, alcohol is abused through spillage. Yeah you’re at YOUR bar, but things are different. Even your friends are occasionally delving into the swearing and abusing.
Now this answer I’m about to give may or may not sit well with Kurt, but if you don’t like it, just stay away. I don’t mean for it to sound negative toward you, because I perfectly understand that it may not be your cup of tea, but my experience says that the bar will only get louder and rowdier the deeper into the playoffs we go.
You are right madpoopz
I often tell people if they do not like a radio show CHANGE the channel. Commenting while watching is very difficult and i found myself caught up in the MB drama more then the on field action, Last night I was a lurker and that was great. Between innings I would check out the board and then close my laptop. I enjoyed the hell out of the game and am really looking forward to the Tigers lighting AJ up tonight.
You can also call people out on their negativity when it gets to be irrational
Or just say “hey, did someone piss in your corn flakes this morning or are you always this grumpy?” That would shut me up at least for a moment
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
You shut up?
#potcallingkettle
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
Nobody wants to be the one that ruins the party for everyone
at least nobody but a troll wants to be “that guy”. I’m always a little surprised when folks tell me that I come off as negative, because that’s not me at all. I’m very analytical, to say the least, and a lot of that tends to be critical- and I also have a very emphatic tone in 2D. I don’t think that you are nearly as negative as what is portrayed, either. It’s just having a critical look at how the team is constructed, how it’s run, the strategy (or lack thereof) behind the moves, etc. Human nature is to focus on the parts where you differ with what you see.
I don’t find people on BYB joining in the conversation for the purpose of annoyance, or just to get a reaction- and that’s really what a troll is/ does. I think madpoopz is right on the money. If you really can’t stand to see moves being criticized, and can’t just take stuff that along with the rah rah stuff, it’s going to be challenging to be on a game thread anywhere. Baseball is a game of failure, and squander, and errors. Just roll with it.
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
I don't mind criticism when it is rooted in thoughtful analsis like those of Tigerdog and David even if it has a negative tone
What I hate is vulgar comments from uninformed Tiger Fans or people that just don’t understand the game. Case in point was the infield singled that against ANY other team would have rolled foul, but since it was a Yankee batter it took a goofy ass spin towards fair territory. Several ignorant fans were blaming Wilson for the event when there was clearly nothing he, Brandon Inge, or Brooks Robinson could have done about it.
I don't think anyone was coming down on the analytical or thought out responces
However, the all caps screaming and cursing and over reaction for every minor thing was overly dramatic and screamed “look at me I’m a good fan because i am yelling about a hit against out pitcher”.
Again, I understand emotions are higher right now because of the situation, but the reactions or so over the top that they ring falsely in my ear, and remind me of what I hate so much about other fans. I just don’t expect Tiger fans to act like it is the end of the world when the opposing team gets a hit, or when one of our players strikes out, or hits into a double play.
This is baseball, people strike out and hit into double plays, lets act like we have been here before.
Agreed. Plus the incessant single-word, curse posts make the thread
nearly impossible to follow.
also agree
Single word anything really. When the Tiges do somethign there’s an explosion of short huzzahs and any ongoing thread disappears and it’s hard to find your way through. I mean, it happens during the regular season too.
Truly the number of commenters — which is a good thing !! — makes it harder for everyone.
Somebody — might have been Ian — and I once joked we need an “A” thread and a “B” thread. You gotta earn your way into the good one haha.
by Kurt Mensching on Oct 6, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Is that really a joke?
Sounds more like a semi-serious thing that would be politically incorrect enough that you should refer to it as a joke.
Just joking!…or not.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
Can't I just hang out on the 'C' thread with Grosberg?
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
Game threads are a bit different, IMO
I think you have to expect a certain amount of ranting during a game, just as you would if you were sitting in a bar with friends and strangers. Things get blurted out, and if you’re not prepared to just scroll by them, you won’t enjoy the experience. People posting one worders or all caps posts are going to be ignored and taken for what they are. Yeah, it’s annoying but just part of the experience.
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
I fully understand game threads are different
I have gotten used to the cheers and jeers when something spectacular happens. Homeruns, lead off doubles, any type of RBI or run scoring play cheers are definitely expected (I have even provided a “boom” now and again for a homerun). Sac Bunts in the first inning, opposing homeruns, and things of that nature I expect the jeers. However, it is almost to the point that every play that includes an out or a hit there is spam of about 10-20 (or more) one word all caps posts, that to me is annoying.
Maybe I just am not as used to the additional people come with the playoffs. It is just getting annoying that every time I try to start typing a post my text box continually gets pushed off the bottom of my page and I am trying five or six times just to catch the “post” button only to have it jump away because 15 people don’t like the strike call on the ball right down the middle.
Last night was better.
I agree that the game threads have been almost uncontrolled in the series, and I was sorely tempted to sit out last night. But I also needed to be among people who understand my emotions about the game. I think it may be due to having soooo many more people on and everyone posting his or her reaction at the same time. It gets really hard to follow. The other problem in the first two games was a lot of side OT conversations that loaded up the thread. We always go off on tangents at BYB (that’s part of our charm) but having 15 of them in a game thread is maddening. Maybe if we ALL made the effort to stay on topic and not just post an “Expletive” just to say something, it might help.
"Some guy told me I should walk with the Lord. I'd rather walk with the bases loaded" Ken Singleton
For the games where I've been in front of the computer
I’ve been reading gamethreads selectively. I mentally skip past the Debbie Downers1 and just pay attention to the people who’re trying to share the experience with friends old and new.
It’s honestly no different than my experience in Real Life, where I have baseball-fan friends with whom I watch and go to games during the regular season. During the playoffs, whether it’s at a bar, a friend’s house or at the ballpark, you get a combination of a lot more casual fans wondering what happened to Johnny Damon and the serious fans who’ve gone into hunker-down DON’T TOUCH ME DON’T LOOK AT ME I AM WILLING THE BALL OVER THE PLATE GAH FUCK YOU CANO DIE DIE DIE mode where their tolerance for tomfoolery2 goes away. This changes the vibe, not always for the better, but it’s just the way things go in sports when the stakes are raised.
I will say that the tighter the spring gets wound, the bigger the bounce when we win. That’s the glory of it.
1 – Except David. If he’s not complaining then the Earth is off its axis.
2 – Such as it ever was
"Virtually all tactical ploys—the sacrifice bunt, the stolen base, the hit-and-run—operate on average to reduce run scoring." -- Eric Walker
It's not complaining, it's reasoned action
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
I find the game threads on here much more positive than what I'm used to elsewhere
and I credit the moderators for that. I think it is human nature to be critical of things. You read an article with 100 sentences and tend to pick out the one thing that you disagree with most. It’s as if the things that you agree with aren’t worth commenting on unless they stand out for some reason. But there isn’t anything remotely close to BYB in terms of having an enjoyable game thread if one is so inclined.
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
If we are not going to sit around and sing kumbaya
What am I supposed to do with the 325 gallons of Kool-Aid I made for the playoffs?
"But the point is, finger-pointing is just what sports fans do when something doesn't go right." -- Kurt Mensching
by RealityIsOptionable on Oct 4, 2011 12:41 PM EDT reply actions
Find 150 gallons of vodka
And have a hell of a party.
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
lol I'll look into that!
My buddies mother-in-law is from Russia. She does not speak one word of English. Anyway, she makes one hell of a batch of home made vodka. When my buddy tells her that is not legal in the United States, she scoffs and says something (loosely translated) " You Americans have to many rules" true story.
"But the point is, finger-pointing is just what sports fans do when something doesn't go right." -- Kurt Mensching
by RealityIsOptionable on Oct 4, 2011 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
WIN
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
Contributor, Bless You Boys
If the game goes badly, don't be negative; be grave, like at a funeral
Because when gravity fails, negativity won’t pull you through.
I generally only open my mouth on here to be critical.
It’s a sort of catharsis for me. My wife won’t listen to me bitch about the Tigers so you guys have to. I try to be rational, but I’ve been accused a few times of being too negative. I think many people use the threads this way though, and I don’t think there’s any way around it. It’s better than breaking something in my house or yelling at my kids.
Quite honestly, the mindless optimism that some posters hold up as the gold standard irritates me more than the most negative posters. When things are going poorly, Leyland is making a horrible decision, Betemit flails at another strike three, etc….I expect people to be pissed off, pessimistic, and ranting rather than policing negative posts and telling people to keep their chin up.
We all know when things are going in the shitter, and I’m not going to lie to myself and be disingenuously positive because some people don’t like negativity. At the same time, I respect the other posters enough not to go over the top (at least I don’t think I do) and treat the thread like a toilet.
IMO, losing isn't the worst thing that can happen
Quitting and Cheating are. It’s not “mindless optimism” either. It’s rationality that baseball is just a game. Sportsmanship means more to me than winning or losing ever will. I can lose with my head held up high if I give it my 100%. Baseball is all puppies and ice cream for me. I don’t need anymore stress in my life.
I'm jealous. I wish it could be that way for me...
but I have a hard time not getting emotionally invested. Like anything else you really care about, when things don’t go well you get upset. I guess I probably wouldn’t watch the games if I didn’t really care if we won or lost and have an emotional stake in the outcome.
I think we’re just fundamentally different people Keith…I’m glass half empty and you’re glass half full. Wish I could be that way too, but it’s definitely not my nature.
I just want the Tigers to win
Then I’ll be ready to read about sportsmanship.
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
Haha...I agree
On Saturday mornings, when I’m at my son’s 5-year-old soccer games, I’m ready to watch some high sportsmanship. When I’m watching the Tigers vs. Rangers, I hope so see some butt-whoopin’.
Naturally, I would like my team to be professional and sportsmanlike. I feel like 95% of the pros go about their business and act in this manner (the exceptions, like Milton Bradley, Zambrano, Njyer Morgan…etc.) are well noted and certainly not glorified. I was disappointed when the team signed Sheff because I always thought he was an ass and him being a Tiger didn’t change my view of that. However, I didn’t boo when he drove in runs for the Tigs.
I guess what I’m saying is that I care about my MLB team winning. I’d much prefer it to be in a professional manner, but I think a team would have a hard time collecting enough punks to make me dislike them (unless you’re Tampa, circa 2004 with Upton, Young, and Elijah Dukes coming up through the system.)
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
It's the playoffs.
The stakes are higher so everything is magnified. During the regular season, after a loss “we’ll get them next time” works but it doesn’t in the playoffs because there might not BE a “next time” until spring.
Everything is more intense in the playoffs and in the moment even people who don’t normally overreact do so.
I’m with Madpoopz. Honestly, if you don’t like it, stay away from the game threads and come back for the analysis afterwards when everyone cools down and can talk more. And if you think THIS place is negative… holy moley, I hope you don’t wander into some of the areas I’ve been. This place is NOTHING like as negative as most. :)
Tribute to the moderators for that.
Random nonsense at @Baroque97
"It is a mistake to try to look too far ahead. The chain of destiny can only be grasped one link at a time." --Sir Winston Churchill (1874 – 1965)
Really
If you think that BYB is bad, go to Mlive.com or Tiger talk on Det News, where they have an automatic word censor designed to prevent the 107 dirty words from being posted, but posters can insult each other all day long. That’s where I started blogging about five years ago, so maybe it’s all relative but I find BYB to be very mild.
I don't care what the Chinese say, 2011 is the Year of the Tiger!
Good point
I’d much rather see a curse word or two than deal with personal attacks. Civil conversation, even if it’s profane, is much more appealing to me.
As for profanity, I don’t mind it at all. However, I’ve seen the mods deal with it when it’s been a problem outside of the game threads.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
I agree with this
BYB has the best Tiger fans.

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