Asking Price Drops For Oswalt, Kuroda, Jackson
Assuming he would play here, I still like the idea of Roy Oswalt on a one-year deal. Especially if reports of his asking price being $8 million are true.
4 months ago
Kurt Mensching
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Dombrowski should be all over Kuroda and Oswalt.
I’d much, much rather get either of these guys on a short term deal than to trade Turner for Garza! Olney says the price for Oswalt is now around $ 8 mil and Kuroda is $ 10- 11 mil? Either one is a steal! DD should be on it, big time.
On Edwin, I’m not so sure. His second half of 2009 was putrid with the Tigers. I dreaded every start of his after the break- and he was a legit All Star in the first half of that season. We don’t have Dave Duncan around to keep him on track. Boras wanted $ 75 Mil for five years initially, but even if he’s down to $ 45/ 4 years, I’d pass. Let him go to the Yankees at that price.
"King of Minutiae"
Couldn't agree more
Especially Oswalt at or near $8MM for one season. This seems to line up exceptionally well for the Tigers and Oswalt. He gets to build value with a team that can score runs and plays in a park that is neutral(no launching pad, is COPA.) A one-year deal allows the Tigers best prospects to hash out whatever issues they have in Toledo.
AND, say Turner is having a monster season in Toledo and gets called up? You’ve got Oswalt in the ’pen for the last couple of months and playoffs.
Oswalt gets a chance at a goodly number of wins due to the Tigers offense, stadium, and team. Helooing to rebuild his value. The Tigers get a season changer on a short deal who could help them in multiple ways.
It’s tough to see a down-side.
Justin can now let the fungus grow back on his shower shoes.
You don't throw Roy Oswalt in the 'pen
If Oswalt is healthy in 2012, he’ll produce. His track record is too strong to think anything otherwise. If we sign Oswalt, Turner will be in AAA until he’s traded or 2013, whichever comes first. I’m totally fine with that. I suspect that if he’s not thrust into Detroit, Turner will have a very solid, but not eye-popping season in Toledo. That’s still great as one of the youngest kids in the league.
The big downside to Oswalt seems to be his health concerns, which fits perfectly with the Tigers. We have 3 or 4 guys in the high minors that could use a little more seasoning before a promotion and Oswalt would allow that if he’s healthy at the start of the season. If the back is a concern after a couple months of pitching, I bet we have somebody in the minors what would deserve a shot.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
Oswalt wouldn't be in the pen
But the odds of at least one of the five starters having a significant injury are pretty strong. Just the way things work. The Tigers have been fortunate the past couple years, but go back not so long, and we’ve got Maroth, Bonderman, Rogers, Willis (thankfully) and even durable Nate missing time with injuries. Oswalt would be worth it for the depth alone.
"King of Minutiae"
You're also overlooking Oswalt's experience
He could be a valuable asset simply for being a mentor for some of the younger pitchers on the staff.
Not sure if someone on a one year deal
is looking to be the leader of the pitching staff. I don’t doubt that he would be a good teammate, but we better not expect him to fix Porcello, Schlereth or Coke. That said, hiring him on his pitching alone for 8 mil is a steal and I really hope DD pushes hard on that.
Well, but Rogers . . .
. . . was here on a 1-year deal, originally.
It's not about being the leader of a pitching staff
It’s about Oswalt possibly offering subtle tips to a younger player like Porcello or Scherzer that could make a big difference in their results. We saw this with Avila and Laird the last time he was here. Avila’s defense went from meh to Gold Glove caliber seemingly overnight. Word is Martinez also gave Avila a couple tips at the plate early last season, and we saw what happened with that too.
by Rob Rogacki on Jan 14, 2012 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
I absolutely agree.
I would have rather had Oswalt on a one-yeal deal than Garza for prospects back when the talk was that Oswalt was looking for considerably more money. Between Oswalt and Kuroda, this just seems like a perfect situation for Detroit.
Go for broke! Sign 'em all!
I’m bored. But a 7 man rotation would be interesting!
"You spend a good piece of your life gripping a baseball, and in the end it was the other way around..." Jim Bouton
Does that mean less Verlander and Fister?
I vote no!
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
No, just more piggyback starts!
Sorry. Still bored.
"You spend a good piece of your life gripping a baseball, and in the end it was the other way around..." Jim Bouton
by JimWalewander on Jan 13, 2012 4:43 PM EST up reply actions
The music from "Deliverance" haunts me, every time I read that term.
"King of Minutiae"
by Tigerdog1 on Jan 13, 2012 5:17 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
On reflection, though
is this another cagey Boras move? Drop the “reserve”, get more bidders?
"You spend a good piece of your life gripping a baseball, and in the end it was the other way around..." Jim Bouton
Sound good
Stop the Yanks of getting one of remaining free agents that are MLB pitchers. That way they are force to go with Garcia and Colon or close to it.
I like Oswalt a lot
He could definitely help us win some games.
I also want to see some of the young arms get an opportunity.
DD can do no wrong here. He’s got a winning hand no matter how he plays it.
He can do wrong if he fails to get another starting pitcher
or a bona fide 2B
or a bona fide 3B
or a couple hitters for the top of the lineup.
All of the above are just plain wrong.
"King of Minutiae"
I think items 1 and 2 are proving difficult
And if you can’t do item 3 by piggybacking it with items 1 or 2, you’re displacing somebody in order to put a better top-of-the-lineup bat in there.
Yes, I used piggyback on purpose.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
Delmon is probably the only guy whose job should be in question
Assuming you can’t find a top-of-the-order bat among the 2B or 3B ranks, the only guy I’d displace for the sake of adding a better #1 or #2 hitter is Delmon Young. The other 6 guys (Avila, Cabrera, Peralta, Boesch, Jackson, and Martinez) are probably best-suited somewhere else in the lineup but shouldn’t lose a job because their bats play better elsewhere.
So, we’ve exhausted ourselves talking about 2B and 3B options that might be good fits at the top of the lineup. There might be people out there like M. Izturis (who the Angels shouldn’t trade, IMO) or Chase Headly (and I think the Pads are reluctant to sell yet) but a deal hasn’t happened yet and DD might prefer to sit on his prospects for now.
So, turn your attention to OF and look for somebody that could replace DY, act as a good 1 or 2 hitter, and let Boesch hit 3. There’s actually a logical candidate on the market for what I believe will be a very affordable contract – Kosuke Fukudome. He’s shown a good OBP for his entire career and enough of everything else to warrant a job. He’s no wizard in the OF, but his defense is certainly better than Young’s and his 3-yr UZR in RF is about league average. There are certainly other options available on the trade market as well.
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
Do you realize that one of our strengths is versatility?
I like how Leyland uses the entire roster and shuffles the line-up. Some of our players might not be good everyday players, but they are worthwhile when used in a platoon. I’ll also take these platoons over some of the full-time players in the majors. The numbers were actually pretty good with the platoons during the 2nd half of last season, so I’ll give them another chance. In the process, we’ll save a ton of cash, and have the flexibility to make some mid-season acquisitions if we need to.
This team has many great strengths, the most important is that we got bona fide super studs in Verlander and Cabrera. We’re the only team to have a pitcher that has won an MVP, Cy Young, and ROY. That World Series Title is next, and it’s inevitable that we win it in 2012.
I admire your optimism
but I’m not sure I’d go as far as “inevitable” hope you’re right. Still want a 3rd baseman.
by atlantatiger on Jan 13, 2012 7:48 PM EST up reply actions
Keith is definitely BYB's most optimsitic
balances us out.
by Kurt Mensching on Jan 13, 2012 8:07 PM EST up reply actions
at 1 year, 8M
I’m allll for Oswalt. I think that’s a much better idea than possibly giving up Turner + others for Garza
Raburn-Santiago '12
Oh Crap.
They are getting Michael Pineda also.
That was a great deal for the Yanks
Seattle is outta their freakin’ mind….
"Goaltending is a normal job, sure. How would you like it in your job if every time you made a small mistake, a red light went on over your desk and 15,000 people stood up and yelled at you."
-Jacques Plante
by DetroitSports on Jan 13, 2012 9:45 PM EST up reply actions
The Yanks done good, but they did take on some risk
Pineda had a rough 2nd half of last season. He has had arm problems in the past and missed most of the 2009 season due to elbow strain. His endurance and health may become issues.
Montero’s value is behind the plate, but the Yankees were going to let him waste away at DH. So trading him wasn’t a difficult decision. After shopping him for 2 years, at least they got something good in return for him.
Let's not forget
Pineida serves it up to LHB and that stadium is a band box for lefties. Not a bad trade, but taking a fly ball pitcher out of safeco and moving him to the bronxbandbox may devastate him.
Tired of generic music??? Exterminate All Rational Thought is here to help!
Maybe
But max they gave up was a good-hitting DH, so they didn’t really have much to lose
"Goaltending is a normal job, sure. How would you like it in your job if every time you made a small mistake, a red light went on over your desk and 15,000 people stood up and yelled at you."
-Jacques Plante
by DetroitSports on Jan 14, 2012 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
Montero is technically a catcher
But with the concerns about his defense, I’ll give you DH. I wonder if they would try to move him to 1st if Smoak doesn’t pan out?
by Rob Rogacki on Jan 14, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
That said,
If Montero is going to play 1B, this would be a really bad trade for Seattle. The real value in Montero is if he can stick as a catcher. Huge jump in value at that position.
"King of Minutiae"
That's up to Montero's defense behind the plate
First basemen can be had, but good hitting catchers are rare.
"King of Minutiae"
Or that means that the price of Oswalt goes up...
since there are less impact pitchers on the market.
"All aboard! There is plenty of room."
Brennan Boesch Bandwagon Conductor
Supply and Demand
Price will depend on the other teams left who are bidding…but teams may panic and jump quickly now.
Yankees out of the picture, big drop in demand, not to mention dollars available
it’s a two edged sword.
"King of Minutiae"
While I am really bored
I don’t think starting pitching is the issue. It definitely was for the Yanks, but their bullpen was scary. It wasn’t that long ago that we were sweating out the last 3 innings in that 5 game series. We have the opposite issue (but Oswalt for 8mil is just too good to pass up). This is a tough year for 3B/2B and that is what i see as the biggest glaring holes. If the yanks signed or traded for a top player in either of those positions then I would have been fuming for sure.
C'mon T-Dog
DD returns a team intact except for the “addition-by-subtraction” moves of losing Maggs and Guillen. A tea, if you remember, that own 95 games and walked away with the Division title.
Meanwhile, the team has a credible back up catcher(remember, you’re a big believer in “defense first” for a back up catcher), Dotel has replaced Perry, and no matter who bats in the 3 it’s hard to believe they’ll be worse than the black hole that Maggs was there in the first half.
Comerica is hardly burning.
Justin can now let the fungus grow back on his shower shoes.
great teams stay great by continuing to push
i know the yankees have oprah money but this is what teams do when they want to compete for championships every year. they don’t necessarily wait for montero to be great. prospects are great, but in the right deal anyone should be fair game. i think this is why we hear dombrowski is at least willing to listen on guys like turner, because standing pat rarely does the trick. look at the rangers this off season as well. one pitch from a championship and they still go out and get darvish, nathan, etc., and wouldn’t be shocked if they get fielder. i hope dave stays aggressive, whatever happens. not stupid or reckless, but definitely not afraid to be aggressive.
Amen brother.
It’s hard to know if DD is just waiting for the right deal or is satisfied with what he’s rolling out there. I like to think it’s the former, but when there upgrades available and nothing yet has happened.
I’ve can’t remember such consolidation of talent this widespread. There are 6-8 teams that could be downright scary.
If Texas gets Fielder and Darvish..
Then I think we need to see if Tim Tebow will start franchising his prayer group. We’ll start a BYB chapter….the name is already apropos.
Between the Angels’ pitching, the Ranger’s offense, and the friggin’ embarrassment of talent in Boston and New York….whoever wins the A.L. this year will deserve it.
And we will deserve it
We all saw what happened with Boston last season. Just because the Angels and Rangers are loading up this offseason doesn’t guarantee them a playoff spot, let alone a championship.
You're missing my point Rob.
Of course loading up doesn’t guarantee anything. But you have to agree there are multiple teams that look like they could be elite, at least on paper. I don’t remember the consolidation of talent being so widespread in a while.
I actually think Detroit has the best chance of anyone to get into the playoffs. Once there, you will have to beat two really good teams to come out…that’s all I’m saying.
Agreed
I’m starting to think our biggest competition this year is KC and Cleveland.
"Goaltending is a normal job, sure. How would you like it in your job if every time you made a small mistake, a red light went on over your desk and 15,000 people stood up and yelled at you."
-Jacques Plante
by DetroitSports on Jan 14, 2012 11:04 AM EST up reply actions
Not necessarily true
the whole point of mlb playoffs is it really could go either way because it’s such a small amount of games relative to the season.
As an example, I’m sure if you told the Rangers last year that they would have to beat the Rays, Tigers, and Cardinals to win the World Series and could miss the Red Sox, Yankees, and Phillies, they would have assumed it’s locked up.
My point is you don’t know who you will face in the playoffs, nothing is a given.
Homefield Advantage in Playoffs
Why not try to have the best league record for homefield advantage…
Homefield is an Advantage!
Two teams from one year is an awfully small sample size…
The Home team has won 55% of all playoff series since the last format change in 1998 and the top seed made the WS 33% of the time (better than the expected 1 in 4 and now more odds)
And maybe this is selfish – but I would like the Tigers to play at home one extra game per series (if needed) for the emotional and financial impact it would have on the fans, city (bars/restaraunts/vendors), team, ownership.
Kuroda is a Yankee
I liked him but I also like E-Jax and Oswalt, but I would rather have Turner or Garza
"I will play tomorrow unless I am dead when I wake up" - Victor Martinez
I'm much rather have Oswalt for a year and Turner for 6 than Garza for 2
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
Goal is NOT the AL Central...
Totally agree…great 3-5 year window for Tigers – DD is waiting for the Cespedes decision and may wait til trade deadline to see what shakes out. Current configuration likely does not compete for WS. Like to see better team defense/speed (not D.Young), top of the order OBP (2B/3B), SP and one more arm for pen.
The goal is always the AL Central.
I’d say that by now it should be apparent that the postseason is almost a total crapshoot. If you’re good enough to get there, chances are high that you’re good enough to win it all.
Not really.
Considering how weak the AL Central was last year, a .500 record would have made the playoffs. The Blue Jays could have won our division last year.
"trout jefferson is using multiple numbers and no swears. I barely recognize you man." - Kurt Mensching
by Trout Jefferson on Jan 14, 2012 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
Especially with the new wild card rule
the goal has to be winning the division, that wild card game is going to be a huge advantage for division winners.
All goals start with the playoffs
Fter that it’s a crap shoot and hope your team is hot.
Winning the AL central guarantees a playoff spot so therefor, should always be the immediate goal.
Tired of generic music??? Exterminate All Rational Thought is here to help!
Finally
Tired of these guys getting overpaid!
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Jan 14, 2012 1:15 AM EST reply actions
All in
I get the argument that the goal should be to win the division but that’s thinking too small right now. Unless we have injuries we pretty much just have to show up to win the Central this year. Cleveland isn’t quite there yet, Kansas City doesn’t have enough pitching, the White Sox are starting over, the Twins lost a bunch of guys and I’ll eat my hat if Morneau and Mauer contribute the way they did in 2006-2009.
Our biggest concern should be being able to keep up with teams like New York and Texas and both of them are looking to be better on opening day then they were at the end of last year while we’ve made no real significant improvements besides giving Avila a little more rest and tightening up the bullpen. I will not be satisfied with just another division title. We need the pieces to play in October, not just April-September.
Winning the division is not "thinking too small"
You basically have to win your division to get into the playoffs. Winning the division takes a balanced roster over a 162 game span. Winning the World Series takes a couple of hot bats and a lights out starting pitcher to win 11 games in a month. Getting to the playoffs is 90% of the battle in the MLB. A lot of luck goes into what happens from then on.
by Rob Rogacki on Jan 14, 2012 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
Doug Fister > Pineda
Certainly from the perspective of trade value, and maybe as a pitcher overall.
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