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Johnny Damon, Carlos Pena among options for replacing Tigers' Victor Martinez

So we've reviewed the cost, statistically anyway, of the Tigers' likely losing Victor Martinez for all of 2012. I've posited that he could probably have been expected to bat about a 300 average, with a .360 OBP and .450 or so slugging average. Now the question arises: How do the Tigers make up for that?

Popular suggestions I've read so far, listed in no particular order:

And I'm sure there's more. I'm not going to dive into detailed accounts of every player. In fact, I like the format others have used today, so I'm just going to do the same and place the players into a couple of categories.

Star-divide


Not going to happen:

Fielder and Ramirez. We've detailed this in the past. Fielder has issues with his father, and his father just happened to hit a lot of home runs in Detroit as a real fan favorite in the first half of the '90s. On top of that, he'd like a multi-year deal worth 9 figures and requires a long-term commitment and possibly the movement of Miguel Cabrera to third base. This is not going to happen. The Tigers have a DH for years to come. They need a player for 2011, and 2011 alone. And what's with this Ramirez stuff? No.

Thanks for playing, but no

Look, I love what Ordonez and Guillen meant to the organization in the past, too, but they are not even going to get close to filling the hole left by Martinez, and no one would even suggest their names if they had spent their careers in, say, Baltimore.

Cespedes gets his own line

I do not view Cespedes is a replacement for Martinez. I'd like to sign him anyway, but I think viewing him as a replacement and expecting the world from him to begin with would be a grave mistake. There's a lot of ifs and buts that come up. If he hits like Clay Davenport expects and plays in the outfield while Delmon Young DHs, that would be wonderful. But he hasn't played ball outside Cuba and should best be allowed time to adapt to professional baseball and get work in at the minor leagues.

Interesting trade possibilities

Names that have come up as trade possibilities are Soriano and Kotchman. Soriano undoubtedly had a down year in 2011, but could generally be expected to hit .250 with a .310 OBP and near .475 slugging. Even then, he's not going to reach Martinez's level of contribution, but at least he can play above-average in the outfield. Plus he's going to cost a lot in terms of dollar commitment -- which is why he's probably available. Carlos Lee is a player MLB.com's Jason Beck suggested. Lee hasn't hit well in a couple of years -- you have to go back to 2008. And he doesn't run well. But maybe -- maybe -- put him in the middle of a productive lineup on a playoff team during a contract year and the 35-year-old re-awakens. It's not a bad idea, but depends on the asking price.

The real possibilities

I think Kotchman, Pena, Damon, Drew and Guerrero fit in here.

After looking closer at Guerrero's career arc and recent season, I rank him last among the group. However, a bounce back from last season in Baltimore could make for a valuable player at the plate -- though not on the basepaths. Although he still hits well, one worry would be the low OBPs he's had in recent years -- including .317 last season despite a .290 average.

Kotchman is interesting. If he could repeat his 2011 figures (.306, .378, .402), there really wouldn't be much drop-off from Martinez. Of course, given his career history -- you have to go back to 2007 to find a comparable year -- believing he'll repeat 2011 seems outlandish.

There's J.D. Drew. He suffered through a real let down in 2011, with injuries and questions about his commitment. The past two seasons he has suffered from below-average BABIP, while his batting average fell from .255 to .222. The OBP, buoyed by a nice walk rate, fell, too. Plus the power dropped off last year. But again, if Drew bounces back, the results could be interesting. Bill James Online projected a .252 / .360 / .415 line. That's about the same on-base percentage as I'd expect from Martinez, but less power. However, Drew could play in the outfield and bump Delmon Young to DH. So I like this idea. He does strike out a lot, though.

Then, you have Damon. He's already played in Detroit once. His average and OBP have dropped a bit over the last few years, but he's still a .265/.345/.410 guy. (Plus my mom would like this idea, because she still hasn't stopped wearing her Damon T-jersey.)

Finally, the man of the hour has been Carlos Pena. The once-Tiger who people apparently see through the prism of his former Tiger years is a good possibility. Pena still strikes out a lot. He also walks like mad. When he's not doing either of those, he hits a home run. Three outcome player, truly. Last year his batting average was an awful .222 but with a .357 OBP and .462 slugging. Against right-handers, he had a .388 OPS and .504 slugging. That's a guy who can be pretty valuable. Find a way to couple him with Delmon Young (.338 OBP, .431 slugging vs. left-handers) or Ryan Raburn (.321, .486) and you've got a decent platoon from a power stand point.

Conclusion

The problem with several of these possibilities is that you just don't know what you're going to get. You're hoping for a bounce back from a veteran player. A few of them rely on you getting the continued performance from a player who had a good 2011. One of them asks you to hope for the best from a guy who hasn't played baseball in the United States. There's a lot of lottery tickets out there. The best case is probably the more consistent guy like Pena who strikes out a lot.

On the whole, I would guess going with a consistent guy who gets you much of the way there would be the best way to go. My pet picks are Damon and Pena. I believe either would get the Tigers about 66% of the way to Martinez's production. At that point, you might only be talking about a win difference. Lee and Drew would probably be on my second level. Kotchman and Guerrero the third. And yes, I still want Cespedes.

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Take the insurance money

and make sure we get Cespedes. Cespedes should be ready around the All-Star break, and V-Mart should be ready for a playoff run.

by rif23 on Jan 18, 2012 3:51 PM EST reply actions  

That would be

a really long ACL recovery, but maybe because of Victor’s age and history of catching his recovery will take exceptionally long (or the team will be exceptionally careful), or maybe the injury is worse than the team has let on. If V-Mart doesn’t come back at all I would still prefer to see us fit Cespedes into the payroll. If DH isn’t working out there will be options at the deadline.

by rif23 on Jan 18, 2012 4:01 PM EST up reply actions  

It's not that long of an ACL recovery, actually

The timeframe for a normal individual is at least 6 months. Elite level athletes usually take over a year to get back to their previous levels of performance.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 4:07 PM EST up reply actions  

I guess ive always seen it the other way

my thought has always been that professional athletes tend to come back faster than regular people who get injuries because they have better surgeons, facilities, etc, basically just more resources. Also i may be wrong but as i understand it athletes tend to come back from ACL surgeries faster than non-athletes because the rest of the knee is in better shape, at least that is how the Dr. explained it to me.

by rif23 on Jan 18, 2012 4:21 PM EST up reply actions  

Does a 'regular' person even NEED his ACL like an elite athlete?

I’d guess it would take the elite athlete longer, because of the demands on his ACL are much larger.

Justin can now let the fungus grow back on his shower shoes.

by Singledigit on Jan 18, 2012 4:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Bingo

The ACL’s main function is as a stabilizer in the knee, especially when changing directions and whatnot (which explains why so many injuries occur in non-contact situations, like V-Mart’s). Elite athletes place a much higher demand on the ACL, so any advantages provided by better surgeons, facilities, etc. (and nowadays, the gap is shortening) are moot. In general, ligaments don’t have their own blood supply, so the healing time is much longer than, say, a broken bone.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Thank you for that comment

by syper17 on Jan 18, 2012 9:51 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions  

this is exactly correct

I had the surgery before. It’s definitely not a fun process, having the surgery or going through the rehab. But my doctor did tell me, if your goal in life was to do nothing but sit around, you technically don’t even need to have ACL surgery… although it’s highly recommended, his point was if you wanted to be inactive you could still survive without it.

With the amount of use and pressure Vmart will continue to put on that knee as a professional athlete, the time frame for him will be longer than a “regular” person.

Raburn-Santiago '12

by tigers22 on Jan 18, 2012 4:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Shouldn't Adam Dunn be on this list?

I bet DD could get him for practically nothing.

#sarcasm

Justin can now let the fungus grow back on his shower shoes.

by Singledigit on Jan 18, 2012 3:58 PM EST reply actions  

I'd love for that to happen

And then for Dunn to improve.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 18, 2012 4:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I wrote this with more than a bit of sarcasm

But wouldn’t it be funny? There’s no way Dunn is as bad as he was last year. If Williams is willing to pay 80-85% of the 3 years of his salary?

Eh … never mind.

Justin can now let the fungus grow back on his shower shoes.

by Singledigit on Jan 18, 2012 4:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Good Article Kurt

Although you sounded exhausted at the end of it and it seemed you really didnt fight for any one of them to be on the team. However, your right, its all a crap shoot. My pic would be Vladdie. He’s still a dangerous hitter, and one that a pitcher would think about not wanting to face should they decide not to pitch to Cabby. I realize his numbers were down some last year, but he still hit decent for power in a lineup that didnt exactly blow any one away. I say if Vlad is in a better lineup, like Vmart last year, vlad will get better pitches. Sorry but Damon is not only washed up, he’s put away wet. Carols its either a hit or a strikeout, and, I think there will be more strikeouts. We already have a strike out king (see Jackson, A). My 2nd choice would be Kotchman. But, we need someone. Please dont let Johnny come marching home again.

by blueleo1 on Jan 18, 2012 4:10 PM EST reply actions  

haha
Although you sounded exhausted at the end of it and it seemed you really didnt fight for any one of them to be on the team

This is an accurate statement!

by Kurt Mensching on Jan 18, 2012 4:44 PM EST up reply actions  

I feel the same way

It’s like picking one thing to eat from a Taco Bell menu. I’d don’t want to eat there, but if you put a gun to my head, I’ll choose either the Mexican Pizza or Nacho Bell Grande. It’s a real crap shoot.

by Keith-Allen on Jan 18, 2012 9:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Sort of.

The real crap shoot comes about an hour later, give-or-take.

by frisbeepilot on Jan 18, 2012 9:21 PM EST up reply actions  

When I read "Ramirez", I thought Hanley.

I got excited. Then I got sad. Then I realized how stupid I was for thinking that.

Oh well.

Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!

by Brand New Hero on Jan 18, 2012 4:17 PM EST reply actions  

while I guess he MIGHT be a trade option

it’d still fall under the “Not going to happen” category.

Raburn-Santiago '12

by tigers22 on Jan 18, 2012 4:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Oh, it's definitely "not going to happen" for a myriad of reasons.

But I couldn’t help but get momentarily excited.

Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!

by Brand New Hero on Jan 18, 2012 4:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Trade for Brandon Phillips

and sign a free agent pitcher to replace the departing starter (Porcello)

by lankownia on Jan 18, 2012 4:22 PM EST reply actions  

man, people are still on the Phillips thing huh?

do they Reds have a stud 2B prospect in waiting that I just don’t know about?

Because other than that… I see no reason why the Reds would trade Phillips. I know he has (or had, maybe they’re resolved?) contract issues, but still. The Reds have been gearing up this winter with Latos and Madson. They have a solid rotation and a pretty nice pen. With Votto and Phillips in the middle of that lineup, and both Pujols and potentially Fielder leaving the NL Central.. the Reds have a real shot at winning that division next year.

Don’t get me wrong, I’d love adding Phillips to this team. Just don’t see any real incentive for the Reds to trade him at this time.

Raburn-Santiago '12

by tigers22 on Jan 18, 2012 4:30 PM EST up reply actions  

If they're willing to spend...

then you’re right. If they’re going to face their market reality, they may be inclined to focus on younger/cheaper players like Porcello, Boesch, Jackson, etc. I’m not really sure what it would take to get him, just that he would hypothetically be available given his cost is going to be $14M per year or more.

by lankownia on Jan 18, 2012 4:40 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't really understand all

of the talk either.. Maybe people think the Reds are ready to plug Billy Hamilton in there with Cozart? Either way, I think they’re sold on him continuing to be a big part of their franchise, both on and off the field. I wouldn’t see them moving him for anything less than a severe overpay, and to be honest, I don’t really want him for the price tag he commands.

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:07 PM EST up reply actions  

It's not so much that the Reds have a prospect ready

But that they probably won’t re-sign him past 2012 and would like to get something in return (although a compensation pick is nothing to sneeze at).

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:08 PM EST up reply actions  

I would take Carlos Lee...

because he has the totally awesome nickname of “El Caballo” (The Horse for those who are 2nd language challenged) and he has been stuck with the hapless Astros the last few years. Put him in the middle of a bad-ass lineup and watch him rake.

by MotorCityCat on Jan 18, 2012 4:30 PM EST reply actions  

Hey now

I have at least pieces of four “second” languages, but none of them happen to be Spanish.

/Equum, le cheval, das Pferd, τος ’ιππος…

"Virtually all tactical ploys—the sacrifice bunt, the stolen base, the hit-and-run—operate on average to reduce run scoring." -- Eric Walker

by johnmoz on Jan 18, 2012 5:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Gaaaah

I was going to reply in French here, but it’s just too rusty to be conversational. Dammit.

Mais serieusement, j’aime Pena plus que Lee.

by frisbeepilot on Jan 18, 2012 6:11 PM EST up reply actions  

haha

yes

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:07 PM EST up reply actions  

He also has a fan section at Minute Maid Park

Of old Mexican guys who dress up in sombreros and stand on the terrace. It’s pretty awesome. If we got him that would be the best part.

http://houston.astros.mlb.com/images/2007/05/23/esh6G3dj.jpg

"I believe in a good kick in the ass. This— I believe. " -- Walker Percy

I tweet about stuff sometimes @jackhitts.

by jhitts08 on Jan 19, 2012 3:12 AM EST up reply actions  

I still really want Cespedes

but if we’re going to end up signing just strictly a DH, I’m going with Pena.

Raburn-Santiago '12

by tigers22 on Jan 18, 2012 4:36 PM EST reply actions  

Now...

That I’m done with knee jerk reacting I tend to agree on Damon and Pena. I might actually favor Damon because of his baserunning and the fact he seemed to be a good influence on Austin Jackson in 2010. In terms of replacing the clubhouse presence and leadership Damon probably also fits better than Pena.

by Sutelc on Jan 18, 2012 4:41 PM EST reply actions  

I don't know about being a good influence.

I think he was just lucky when Damon was playing for the team.

by thepartybird on Jan 18, 2012 8:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Kosuke Fukudome

I’ve said his name a couple of times…at the risk of beating the dead horse, I’ll say it once more. Fukudome has proven to be a very solid OBP guy . Beginning in 2008, his OBP’s were .359, .375, .371, and .342 last year (combined CHC/CLE). While OBP is his calling card, he also hits .260 with amazing consistency and adds a little pop with 10-15 HR per year and about 30 doubles. He doesn’t have much speed and is an average corner OF on defense.

Fukudome would upgrade the team in two ways. First, he would be a good #2 hitter. I’d like to see that .350+ OBP just a couple of spots in front of Cabrera. I’d like to see his lefthanded bat behind Jackson if Jackson is on first. His K rate is probably going to be about 18%, which isn’t great, but just a tick or two worse than we’d expect from Johnny Damon and substantially better than Carlos Pena. Second, his glove certainly plays better than Delmon Young’s. Adding Fukudome to a corner would tighten the defense and allow Young to DH.

I’m also guessing the Fukudome would come in at about 5M or less per year. With Young on his way out, I’d even be willing to put a two year offer on the table.

Fukudome’s got a bad rep, mostly because he wasn’t worth the money the Cubs gave him. He’s still a productive player.

I guess there are two cautions. First, his time in Cleveland last year wasn’t good from an OBP standpoint. If they guy’s not getting on base at a better clip than .340, he loses a lot of his value. Second, he doesn’t give us a 3 or 5 spot bat. I’d argue that we have players in position already (Boesch and Avila) that actually make better candidates than even what we’ll find on the market, so I’m not too worried about that, especially if we upgrade substantially at #2.

The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981

by momotigers on Jan 18, 2012 4:51 PM EST reply actions  

I'd prefer to stay away from Fukudome.

He was a great player 2-3 years ago, but has just steadily declined. I’d look elsewhere. Good post, though.

by Freebird on Jan 18, 2012 5:42 PM EST up reply actions  

Trumbo

Don’t the Angels have room to drop him off with Pujols and such? It would be interesting and I have no idea what it would take, just something that came to my mind.

by zackw27 on Jan 18, 2012 5:20 PM EST reply actions  

Kendry Morales?

Is it realistic for us to give them a small-package for him?

I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.

by 10inchexplosion on Jan 18, 2012 5:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Because he doesn't get on base.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 18, 2012 6:47 PM EST up reply actions  

I think they're open to trading somebody away

can’t be certain who it is, though.

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:09 PM EST up reply actions  

He's got power, but he never walks.

He’s a little like Delmon Young.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 6:10 PM EST up reply actions  

great comparison

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:09 PM EST up reply actions  

If you're looking for an Angel . . .

Somebody like Abreu might be more doable (and he’s Venezuelan!)

by rea on Jan 18, 2012 7:39 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm all in for Pena.

I was a huge fan of his while he was on the Rays a few years back. Damon would be the 2nd best option, even though I’d prefer Cespedes before Damon.
1. Pena (Cespedes would be nice too.)
2. Just Cespedes
3. Damon

by Freebird on Jan 18, 2012 5:36 PM EST reply actions  

I vote Pena, as well

if Cespedes isn’t there, I’d have the most faith in Carlos

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:10 PM EST up reply actions  

I was freaking out about this injury yesterday,

But really, it’s not a huge deal. We still have the Central in the bag, and anything can happen to anyone once you get in the playoffs. Just look at the Cardinals last year after losing Wainright, perfect example of what we should try to be.

by Freebird on Jan 18, 2012 5:38 PM EST reply actions  

It's definitely a huge deal

But there are other options for the Tigers to be successful in 2012.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 10:53 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't love 50 game suspensions

"I'm a simple man. I like pretty, dark-haired women and breakfast food" - Ron Swanson

by rock n rye on Jan 18, 2012 7:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Exactly

we’d really be in the same situation.. We’d be down both he and Victor until the ASB (probably alot more for Victor). We need to sign somebody who can actually play the whole year

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:11 PM EST up reply actions  

Based on what?

Wow. I didn’t think Manny had any fans left.

What, precisely, do you like about him?

Did you like him when he was a good baseball player and have forgotten he’s no longer that guy? Or, you’re referring to liking him as a person (no accounting for taste, I guess)?

by Big Z in Orlando on Jan 19, 2012 1:41 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Manny is a great clutch hitter

this isn’t based on statistics or anything – i just think when his team needed a big hit (2-3 years ago), he got it.

then aside, i think he’s a big goof, and i like big goofs. he’s entertaining.

and yes the 50 game suspension blows.

the tigers won’t get him, but i’d rather have him than carlos pena, even if carlos pena is better – he’ll more than likely frustrate me without entertaining me

by redwingxviii on Jan 19, 2012 3:16 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree on entertainment value

It’s hard to beat a sports start doing something unpredictable, and that’s great entertainment.

But… it’s way more fun if it’s happening to someone else’s team, if you ask me.

by Big Z in Orlando on Jan 19, 2012 3:39 PM EST up reply actions  

Speaking as a Red Sox fan

You guys do not want Drew, he’s been slowly falling apart for years, and I’m not sure his heart is really in the game anymore. He’s a fantastic bat when he’s focused, but when he’s distracted, thinking about retirement, he suffers, as 2011 shows.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 6:06 PM EST reply actions  

Did Boston fans hate him the moment he flew into town?

Not accusing you in particular of anything, but I have never seen a Red Sox fan that likes him and I’ve never really seen why.

by thepartybird on Jan 18, 2012 8:27 PM EST up reply actions  

I actually love Drew

I think he’s a great guy, and until last year he was a hell of a ballplayer. The reason the mainstream fans, and I’m sure there are guys on the Tigers who this happens to as well, hate him is because he was being paid a lot, but didn’t have the flashy numbers, avg, RBI, HR.

We love him over at OTM, and were heartbroken to see his last couple years with us go so poorly. I wish him well in the future, but he really should retire at this point.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 8:30 PM EST up reply actions  

So he's the exact opposite of Brandon Inge

who is beloved by mainstream Tigers fans, but sucks and won’t go away no matter how many times we pray that he retires.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 10:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Exactly

I wish Inge would retire too, for what it’s worth, it’s depressing watching baseball players hang on longer than they should.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:31 AM EST up reply actions  

In Inge's case

That was sometime around 2005.

"Virtually all tactical ploys—the sacrifice bunt, the stolen base, the hit-and-run—operate on average to reduce run scoring." -- Eric Walker

by johnmoz on Jan 19, 2012 11:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Hanley, Hanley, Hanley

Trade Porcello and any 2 other arms in the minors not named Turner along with one of Garcia/Fields to Miami for Hanley. Something like Porcello/Oliver/Smyly/Fields.

Sign Cespedes, go ahead and DH Young all season.

Turner takes Porcello’s spot in the rotation. Pick up a last minute veteran for the last spot in the rotation and keep whoever is left not traded to Miami on call.

Justin can now let the fungus grow back on his shower shoes.

by Singledigit on Jan 18, 2012 6:54 PM EST reply actions  

As much flak

as you’ll get for suggesting that quote/unquote rosterbation (Hanley), I really think Miami would bite on a deal like that. Dombrowski is obviously the only guy in baseball with as good of a rapport with that front office.. if anybody could get it done, it’d be Dave.

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, Yes, Yes to Hanley for Porcello / Prospect Package

Solves long term need for speed / proven top of order hitter / 3B immediately.

(would also risk moving Peralta to 3B to accomodate Hanley)

Besides Castellanos is mutliple years away…and would give Marlins more $$ to sign Cespedes

by Boomer Dog on Jan 18, 2012 11:48 PM EST up reply actions  

Headley > Hanley

and he’s much cheaper.

"King of Minutiae"

by Tigerdog1 on Jan 18, 2012 11:51 PM EST up reply actions  

Let's not get ahead of ourselves here

Yes, Headley would be much cheaper, but he’s not better than Hanley Ramirez. Hanley had one bad season, but has otherwise been an elite player for his entire career.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:57 PM EST up reply actions  

When you consider the contracts, I'd much rather have Headley

Word is that he actually LIKES to play baseball.

"King of Minutiae"

by Tigerdog1 on Jan 19, 2012 1:28 AM EST up reply actions  

Production > liking it or not

I’m all about winning!

I have a grand idea: let's win a game.

by 13194013 on Jan 19, 2012 4:56 AM EST up reply actions  

That changes things

If we’re talking pure talent and production, it’s Hanley by a landslide. I don’t question his love for the game, just his effort at times. And yeah, that contract.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 19, 2012 9:18 AM EST up reply actions  

Knock it off

I’ve already bookmarked Headley for Boston.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:35 AM EST up reply actions  

The Marlins are back in "win now" mode and looking to fill a new ballpark

I really don’t see them giving up a proven guy who can pass for a fan favorite on a team with no actual fans for a #3/4 starter and prospects.

"Virtually all tactical ploys—the sacrifice bunt, the stolen base, the hit-and-run—operate on average to reduce run scoring." -- Eric Walker

by johnmoz on Jan 19, 2012 11:39 AM EST up reply actions  

retread tigers

why is it you always come up with ex tigers…damon has a lollipop arm…and pena isnt gonna come cheap….no mention of a very fleet juan pierre or ex tiger cody ross? both are free agents…these suggestions you are writing about are ass bad as your wanting oswalt…he’d get ripped in the AL

by paul wall 1962 on Jan 18, 2012 7:06 PM EST reply actions  

damon's lollipop arm

wouldnt matter anyways because he’d DH

by dominator039 on Jan 18, 2012 7:27 PM EST up reply actions  

pierre...

pierre has something the tigers lack…speed…i suppose we just throw another slow plodder in the lineup like damon or pena…im talking young at dh and pierre in left…or are you happy with delmon butchering every ball hit over his head??? yes, it was a typo..1 too many s’s…

by paul wall 1962 on Jan 18, 2012 10:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Pierre's UZR was -9.2 last season in left field

By comparison, Delmon Young’s was only -2.8. In 2010, Young’s UZR was -10.0. Arguing that Pierre is a defensive upgrade is futile.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:16 PM EST up reply actions  

using your own logic

cross off Cody Ross for being a re-tread. And cross off Juan Pierre for not being very good at baseball

"I'm a simple man. I like pretty, dark-haired women and breakfast food" - Ron Swanson

by rock n rye on Jan 18, 2012 7:27 PM EST up reply actions  

ross

cody never actually played for the tigers…if he did it was very minimal…im sure he was traded out of the minor league system…so he’s not actually a retread

by paul wall 1962 on Jan 18, 2012 10:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Any actual analysis on the Oswalt thing

or are you just being intellectually lazy and assuming that any pitcher who changes leagues will automatically completely change?

by thepartybird on Jan 18, 2012 8:31 PM EST up reply actions  

What's BYB's opinion overall on Oswalt?

Now that Texas has signed Darvish, I expect him to choose a destination soon. I’m hoping it’s Boston, because that’s the only way I can see to salvage our offseason, but I’m worried Dombrowski is going to jump in and grab him.

Your rotation would be absolutely sick with Oswalt by the way, top three in the AL, if not the best.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 8:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes please

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 18, 2012 9:33 PM EST up reply actions  

By all reports, 1 year/8 million.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:36 AM EST up reply actions  

Other than Mr. Wall, most of BYB is in favor of Oswalt

I’ve got a voodoo doll ready, just in case he decides to go elsewhere.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 10:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Unfortunate for him, I've got one in case he decides to go somewhere other than Boston.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:36 AM EST up reply actions  

God damn Pierre

I grew to hate him this year when listening to the White Sox broadcasts in the car. Hearing Ed Farmer call him “Jean Pierre” with a stupid faux-French accent every time he stepped up to the plate made me barf a little in my mouth.

"I believe in a good kick in the ass. This— I believe. " -- Walker Percy

I tweet about stuff sometimes @jackhitts.

by jhitts08 on Jan 19, 2012 3:17 AM EST up reply actions  

Domonic Brown

Domonic Brown…He’s not a big bat that everyone wants, but he has fallen out off the radar for the Phillies. His work ethic has been questioned, but if we could get him for cheap, I’d love to have him around.

Also

by rob1689 on Jan 18, 2012 7:26 PM EST reply actions  

Yeah, I know. But Brown being a top 50 prospect at one point…if we could pry him away, I’d be thrilled.

Also…I didn’t really have a thought. I think I just forgot to delete that.

Something is coming…can’t wait for the move!

by rob1689 on Jan 18, 2012 8:03 PM EST up reply actions  

I like this

And I could see Turner for Brown.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 18, 2012 8:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Same

I’m not sold on Dom and Philly will want far too much in return for him

Chicks dig me, because I rarely wear underwear and when I do it's usually something unusual

by BrianCMU. on Jan 18, 2012 11:15 PM EST up reply actions  

He's still only 24, which is why you have to think about it

But I don’t know if he’s one to put it all together. His position is also working against him. Unless he becomes a complete superstar, outfielders like him are a dime a dozen in the MLB. He doesn’t play a premium position or fill a need for this roster.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:18 PM EST up reply actions  

No, send Smyly!

I hate the letter y!

I have a grand idea: let's win a game.

by 13194013 on Jan 18, 2012 11:32 PM EST up reply actions  

I can't see his name

and not read it as “Demonic.”

"Virtually all tactical ploys—the sacrifice bunt, the stolen base, the hit-and-run—operate on average to reduce run scoring." -- Eric Walker

by johnmoz on Jan 19, 2012 11:41 AM EST up reply actions  

Not Pena!

Pena does not come close to replacing VMart. He strikes out way too much. What good is walking going to do hitting behind MCab? We need someone that can hit. I say best bet at a FA DH is Vlad. He did bat close to .300 and drove in nearly 70 rbi’s on a horrible Orioles team. Just throwing this out there. Derrick Lee has alway been a high OPS guy? I think our best move would be a trade for a big name. How about David Wright from Mets?

by DavisonTigerfan on Jan 18, 2012 7:48 PM EST reply actions  

But...

Are we looking to “replace” V-Mart, or are we seeing this as an opportunity to add pieces to make us better now and give us depth in the future for when V-Mart comes back next year?

by rob1689 on Jan 18, 2012 8:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Rental

I think we go after a 1 year rental player. that’s why I suggested Vlad or Derrick Lee. If we could get Wright from mets we cold slide Delmon into DH and put Raburn or Wilks in LF.

by DavisonTigerfan on Jan 18, 2012 8:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Rental

Wright obviously wouldn’t be a rental!

by DavisonTigerfan on Jan 18, 2012 8:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I bet Cherington would be willing to trade Kevin Youkilis

:)

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 8:34 PM EST up reply actions  

Youkilis

I’d take Youk. Only if they put his locker next to Porcello’s!

by DavisonTigerfan on Jan 18, 2012 9:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Cherington would probably trade him

but he’d want a starting pitcher in return.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 9:22 PM EST up reply actions  

You probably wouldn't get one out of our rotation

That’s the thing: you might get Scherzer, but that opens a hole too. So we’d need to fill it with two starting pitchers.

FWIW, if we had Oswalt signed and in the rotation, I might do Scherzer for Youklis.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 18, 2012 9:34 PM EST up reply actions  

That's what I thought

it’s why the Youk for Marcum train never got going either.

I’d love to have Scherzer in Boston, but I just don’t see a trade working out there.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 9:35 PM EST up reply actions  

If we were to pull something like that off

I would hope that Oswalt is offered a multi-year deal, or has options tacked on to the one-year deal he seems to prefer right now.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:02 PM EST up reply actions  

We'd theoretically have Turner and Smyly waiting in the wings

So I wouldn’t worry as much.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 18, 2012 11:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Will Smyly be ready by 2013 though?

By all accounts he made a pretty significant jump last season. I’d like to see if that was the real deal or if 2011 was a fluke, so to speak.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Interesting that this discussion went down so well

Usually when I bring up trade suggestions on other sites they respond with “OMG, U R DUM RED SUX FAN. OUR TEEM IS BETTER THAN URS, WE DUN WANT UR SMELLY PLAYERS.”

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Good to know.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:44 AM EST up reply actions  

Red Sox fans have become just as insufferable, as a whole.

That whole Red Sox Nation marketing schtick didn’t help.

I have a grand idea: let's win a game.

by 13194013 on Jan 19, 2012 3:44 PM EST up reply actions  

The Southie accents don't help

No offense if you have one, LoneDavid. You’re cool.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 19, 2012 3:52 PM EST up reply actions  

I live in Kalamazoo dude.

I haven’t lived in New England for 11 years.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 5:07 PM EST up reply actions  

agree with this

Before 2004, I could see rooting for them against the evil empire. now they are an evil empire.

by Kurt Mensching on Jan 19, 2012 4:49 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't think the "evil empire" label works anymore

There are too many of them, Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Texas, LAA… all spend tons of money and are constantly competitive. Detroit’s creeping up there too.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 5:08 PM EST up reply actions  

The Yankees have an "empire" and their own Network.

Hell, even the Orioles have MASN.

I’m not trying to defend the pink hats, they annoy me to no end just like I’m sure they do to you. I’m just frustrated with having people roll their eyes at me when I tell them I’m a Sox fan.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 5:17 PM EST up reply actions  

I'd think the way this organization moves players, yeah

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

by David Tokarz on Jan 19, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions  

I am so glad

that everyone told me that after the 5th batter in the line-up for each team the game is over. I mean it isn’t like we are going to have Peralta (80+ RBI last year) and Avila (also 80+ RBI last year) hitting behind the 350+ OBP Pena to help hit him and Cabby (who will be in scoring position since Pena walked him to 2B…) in.

by wilsonm24 on Jan 18, 2012 8:43 PM EST up reply actions  

No, we need someone who is good at baseball.

Vlad is not good at baseball anymore – he was replacement level last year by fWAR.
I don’t understand the support for Vlad here. He is worse than Andy Dirks and would cost money the Tigers could be giving to a better player (if Pena doesn’t happen, Oswalt or even Cespedes fit the bill).

About Pena’s patience potentially working against the Tigers: If Pena is walked after Cabrera was pitched around, that’s a good thing. Avila at the plate with at least two aboard sounds pretty good, doesn’t it? If they want to put more guys on base, why stop them? It all comes down to not making outs, which Pena does much better than Vlad (with a lot more power to boot).

by thepartybird on Jan 18, 2012 8:49 PM EST up reply actions  

The problem with Vlad is the drop off in power last season

He’s never been a great OBP guy but made up for it because he’s as strong as a gorilla. It remains to be seen if his drop in power (119 OPS+ in ’10 to 101 in ’11) is due to age or just a fluke season for a crappy team.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:05 PM EST up reply actions  

i would take vlad

just me. the guy can still hit. maybe not as many hrs but still. no pena or damon! problem solved if we get cepedes, young can dh. but that is all hoping he pans out.

by yappy007 on Jan 18, 2012 8:22 PM EST reply actions  

you tube video....

…does not make a MLB player. Cespedes is not going to be the second coming of the say hey kid Willie Mays! The Cuban league is Single A ball here. We need a lead off hitter (Juan Pierre) to get Jackson down to 9 Move Cabrera to 3 and Delmon Young to 4

by BengalsNme on Jan 18, 2012 9:57 PM EST reply actions  

His Winter League numbers have me less than impressed

Small sample size though.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 18, 2012 10:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Here's the thing....

For reasons even I don’t completely understand, I now live in Miami. I can tell you the team down here is really going to go ape about signing this guy. Baseball doesn’t sell in this town (WEIRD I KNOW) but getting a Cuban wunderkind in center might get the locales involved for a year or two. I think the Marlins really will do anything to sign the kid. I realize it makes as much sense as that 2012 movie, but I think he’s a Marlin.

by Flying J on Jan 18, 2012 10:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Cespedes prefers Cubs???

Heard Cespedes said Theo “pursued” him the most and Cubs have the inside track…

by Boomer Dog on Jan 18, 2012 10:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Has any Cuban League player really panned out recently?

Jose Iglesias was supposed to be Ozzie Smith, but that didn’t work out. Aroldis Chapman was supposed to be Randy Johnson, but he’s a wild setup guy…

The only guy I can think of really amounting to anything spectacular is Luis Tiant, am I overlooking people?

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:42 AM EST up reply actions  

True, I forgot he was from Cuba

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 9:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Kendrys Morales

before he busted his leg celebrating his “limp off” homer.

"King of Minutiae"

by Tigerdog1 on Jan 19, 2012 11:17 AM EST up reply actions  

And they rave

because he can do things like This

by rif23 on Jan 19, 2012 8:45 AM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Carlos Lee

The guy’s stats weren’t bad at all, not to mention he strikes out fewer times than Martinez, and walks, & homers more. Sure, he can’t run, but he stole more than Martinez. Houston is willing to take most of his salary off, and we may be able to package and get Rodriguez and Lee. Solving 2 problems in 1 trade.

by JoshLank on Jan 18, 2012 10:05 PM EST reply actions  

What about the other Lee?

Derek Lee? He could be an option.

"I believe in a good kick in the ass. This— I believe. " -- Walker Percy

I tweet about stuff sometimes @jackhitts.

by jhitts08 on Jan 18, 2012 10:08 PM EST reply actions  

I'd still take Pena over him

But it’s not a bad idea. Much more patient hitter than Guerrero.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 18, 2012 11:08 PM EST up reply actions  

I think Pena is my No. 1 option, too

But I always liked DLee. I did just look up his baseball-reference page though and it aid he only took 33 walks last season… way down from his normal average. But then again, he was playing for Baltimore and Pittsburgh and was sort of relied upon to be the No. 1 run producing guy there.

So I dunno. If he can get back on track this year I’d take him if we couldn’t get Pena.

(As a point of comparison, though: Vlad only walked 19 times. So I would rather not have him.)

"I believe in a good kick in the ass. This— I believe. " -- Walker Percy

I tweet about stuff sometimes @jackhitts.

by jhitts08 on Jan 19, 2012 3:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Exactly

Vlad’s game is not going to age well because he doesn’t walk a lot. The average will probably always be there (see: Magglio) but the power won’t. Lee’s walks will probably jump back up this season no matter where he plays. He would be a good fit in the 3 spot if we don’t sign Pena, IMO. I wonder if he has any problems DHing.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 19, 2012 9:20 AM EST up reply actions  

Get the best hitter that bashes right handed pitching the best

That way our line-up will be more balance and since we have two platoons going what is one more.

by Barry2 on Jan 18, 2012 10:15 PM EST reply actions  

Cabrera hit better without VMart in the lineup

.338/.442/.577 (141 games with VMart) and .394/.494/.652 (18 games without VMart)

by GWilson on Jan 19, 2012 1:09 AM EST reply actions  

Sample sizes!

"trout jefferson is using multiple numbers and no swears. I barely recognize you man." - Kurt Mensching

by Trout Jefferson on Jan 19, 2012 3:51 AM EST up reply actions  

Pena

Pena, Cespedes, Damon, Lee(if we give virtually nothing & they eat all but 5 mil)…after that…id just asume DH delmon play raburn in left & platoon santiago w Worth

by Wolverine119 on Jan 19, 2012 1:22 AM EST via mobile reply actions  

I realize this may not be a popular opinion

But Carl Crawford might be a good fit for you guys. He’d actually be able to play defense in a stadium with a real LF, would allow you to move Young to DH, and could fit into your #2 spot in the rotation when (if) he bounces back from wrist surgery. I know he’s risky, and he’s expensive, but if Boston picks up, say, a third of his salary and doesn’t ask for Jacob Turner in return, could a deal get done here?

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 10:23 AM EST reply actions  

I would say

but I think Boston wouldn’t give up on him that soon

by Kurt Mensching on Jan 19, 2012 10:29 AM EST up reply actions  

I've said this since Boston signed him

Crawford does not fit in Fenway Park. He’s the exact opposite type of player that Boston needs in front of the Monster. Instead of a rangy guy who can cover a lot of ground, Fenway needs an arm guy who can pick off the runner trying to stretch Monster hits into doubles.

He’s also had terrible offensive numbers throughout his career at Fenway, which, through nine games per year over 8 years is hardly a small sample size. He doesn’t fit the Boston player profile, and is taking up money that could be better served locking up Ellsbury to a long-term deal, or signing a pitcher so the Sox have a competent rotation.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 10:41 AM EST up reply actions  

I would do that deal in a heartbeat

Boston would be fools to do it though. Crawford is much better than his numbers last year. I don’t know if he can hold up till the end of his contract, but he will probably perform too it for the next couple years.

by wilsonm24 on Jan 19, 2012 10:35 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm not a fan of Crawford

But I agree that he would solve the problems that you mentioned. I was against signing him last offseason because I thought he would be overpaid, and he was. I think that Boston’s demands would start with Turner and/or Nick Castellanos though, so I don’t see a deal like that happening from our end.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 19, 2012 11:33 AM EST up reply actions  

I was thinking Scherzer/Smyly

For Crawford/Doubront/cash.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 11:39 AM EST up reply actions  

Which, now that I'm looking at it

seems a lot to give up from your side.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 12:09 PM EST up reply actions  

I think the Red Sox would try to get a bit more.

Though contract considerations may play into it; not sure Detroit would give up Scherzer for the reason Tokarz mentioned above.

I have a grand idea: let's win a game.

by 13194013 on Jan 19, 2012 3:48 PM EST up reply actions  

That's why I had Doubront in the deal

He’s not Scherzer, but prior to 2011 he put up numbers that are somewhat similar to Porcello.

The Red Sox would want to trade Crawford, if they traded him at all for ML-ready starting pitching. That’s their big hole right now.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 5:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Finding a DH is relatively easy. We suck at Third Base.

Why not solve the problem this way. Trade for David Wright and have him hit behind Miguel. His career stats are as follows: BB: 11.2%, K: 18.8%, ISO: 208, AVG: 300, OBP: 380, SLG: 508.

Inge can make himself somewhat useful as a late inning defensive replacement. Delmon moves to DH. Rayburn and Dirks platoon in left. Santiago plays second.

Delmon essentially becomes our “one year rental” to replace Victor. Wright stays for up to two years until Castellanos is ready.

Rayburn or Dirks leads off. Delmon bats third. Wright fifth. Jackson ninth.

Trade Porcello to get Wright. We will win the Central again with this line up. We need three very strong starting pitchers to get to the World Series. We already have them in
Verlander, Fister and Scherzer. Pick up a free agent pitcher for our fourth slot and give the fifth to whichever young pitcher steps up.

by FungoDave on Jan 19, 2012 10:56 AM EST reply actions  

a few things

I’m pretty sure Wright has only one year on his contract with an option that he can opt out of or gets voided if he is traded, so he would basically be a rental too. Also the Mets would ask for Turner and/or Castellanos plus other pieces in the deal. The lack of offense at 3rd can be made up by the fact the the Tigers get offense out of positions that the rest of the AL is weak in (C, SS, and if Raburn produces 2B) and having the best hitter in the AL helps a bit too. I think signing or trading for guys to get on base in front of Miguel would be more beneficial

"I'm a simple man. I like pretty, dark-haired women and breakfast food" - Ron Swanson

by rock n rye on Jan 19, 2012 11:37 AM EST via Android app up reply actions  

The Wright idea isn't terrible

But your setup is all wrong. Raburn and Santiago are platooning at 2B. This has already been decided by the Tigers’ brass. Young will be in LF unless Cespedes is signed and is actually the guy in these videos. Unless Oswalt is signed, the rotation won’t get us to the World Series, and I would question whether it would even win us the division.

by Rob Rogacki on Jan 19, 2012 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

Michael Young

If Texas really wants to make a run at Fielder, they need to free up some cash, Michael Young would be the perfect fit for us. He cold play second, third, first or DH

by ccaruss on Jan 19, 2012 10:59 AM EST reply actions  

I would love Young

Just don’t think it will happen. Mostly because I don’t believe Texas really wants Fielder for the amount of money and length of contract it will require. In fact, Fielder may have real trouble getting anywhere near the contract he wants simply because it carries so much risk for anyone to take on.

The idea of a long-term fix at second base is VERY appealing, however.

by FungoDave on Jan 19, 2012 11:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Young would be great for us

But I’d be very surprised if Texas would help a team that they’re likely to face in the playoffs again this season upgrade that significantly.

"Virtually all tactical ploys—the sacrifice bunt, the stolen base, the hit-and-run—operate on average to reduce run scoring." -- Eric Walker

by johnmoz on Jan 19, 2012 11:51 AM EST up reply actions  

If it helps them leapfrog the Angels

I could see that being done.

"There's something out there, beyond the horizon in the corner of your eye. I'm going to find out what it is."
-Thomas Solomon, Gentleman Adventurer.

by TheLoneDavid on Jan 19, 2012 11:54 AM EST up reply actions  

A year ago, when Michael Young was asking to be traded,

maybe you could have gotten him for a reasonable price.
Probably not now.
Problem with all this speculation is that the better options are not free agents, and it is hard to imagine any team parting with one of them without demanding a LOT in exchange.
I do like the idea of replacing Delmon in the outfield, using him as the regular DH, and adding a solid OBP guy for the front end of the order, preferrably one who can play third and maybe spell Santiago at second as needed. Michael Young would fill that bill nicely.

by knucklescarbone on Jan 19, 2012 3:01 PM EST up reply actions  

And even then (last year)

the Rangers would not pull the trigger on a trade.

by knucklescarbone on Jan 19, 2012 3:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Martinez

Other teams might see this as a chance to upgrade 3B or 2B, but it seems the Tigers are willing to let Inge/somebody hold the space for Castellanos, and they are willing to put up with the worst 2B defense in the civilized world to keep Raburn’s bat in the lineup. Absent changes at 2B or 3B, I might look to add a left fielder who can actually play a little defense, (Cespedes? We don’t really know how Cespedes’s performance elsewhere matches up) and move Delmon to DH. The biggest real fear is whether or not Victor is the new Guillen.

by Bigpaw on Jan 20, 2012 10:01 AM EST reply actions  

FWIW I will be surprised if the Tigers are able to

out-bid the Marlins for Cespedes. His value as a fan-draw is likely far higher in Miami, especially since the Tigers already have such a strong fan base.

by knucklescarbone on Jan 20, 2012 3:48 PM EST reply actions  

Martinez

Yes, bid for Cespedes, but don’t put faith in him for this year (see Scott Sizemore). Personally, I like the Fukudome-style option – get an OBP guy who can defend and doesn’t cost too much, move Delmon to DH. Don’t back down on Cespedes.

by Bigpaw on Jan 20, 2012 5:28 PM EST reply actions  

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