Why Tigers fans don't care what you think of Prince Fielder's contract
There are so many questions with Prince Fielder signing a nine-year, $214-million contract with the Tigers that need to be answered. Originally I was going to do this burning questions style, but I think I'll just crank out a series of shorter posts to help keep conversation lines more organized.
Start with the obvious question: Nine years? $214 million?! Are the Tigers crazy? Are they going to regret this in the end?
That is the way the question has been framed by most in the baseball commentary world, as we covered in yesterday's links roundup. Rob Neyer's headline goes so far as to ask "Will Prince Fielder's contract rank among the worst ever?" in a headline on his story at Baseball Nation.
I'll be honest, I think it's all a bit of lunacy and breathless commentary from an industry that peddles in breathless commentary.
This is the era where top players are paid upwards of $20 million a season to play baseball. In terms of dollars per year, Fielder's contract currently ranks seventh at about $23.8 million a year. There are actually 15 contracts right now that average at least $20 million a year.
Fielder fits in roughly with Albert Pujols, Ryan Howard, Adrian Gonzalez and Joe Mauer in annual compensation and the length of the deal. Sure he's maybe a million higher a year, but I hardly find that to be a reason to freak out. On a shorter deals, you can add in names like Miguel Cabrera or Mark Teixeira. And what do these players all have in common? They more or less are all first basemen/designated hitter types, and some are fellow bigger-bodied players. It sure looks to me that MLB baseball teams have pegged a certain value to players of this ilk, and it looks appears like Fielder's fits in.
The two things that make Fielder's deal stand out to people are
No. 1) The fact the total figure come in at $214 million and places Fielder's take fourth overall in largest contracts ever handed out.
No 2) The fact that Fielder is a big boy, and those do not typically age well. Neyer notes that the aging curve ought to frighten Tigers fans.
The first, I say: Sure the deal is large, but that's because it's a nine-year deal and Fielder was the second-best player this offseason. Am I supposed to worry about nine years from now? Really? As economists say, in the long run we're all dead. I'm going to bet that nine years from now, Fielder is no longer among the highest-paid players. Nine years ago, $13 million a year was a whole lot of money. Now $13 million would be hard pressed to crack the top 50 list.
The aging curve has players of Fielder's size peaking during age 23-24. At age 27, Fielder shows no signs of being a worse hitter. If he's not going to have peak sabermetric value because he'll be a DH, well, so be it. As I've already shown, his contract is comparable to that type of player.
So the general story line, and I do subscribe to this, is that Fielder will not be worth what he's getting paid by the end of his contract. I'll cede the point.
I believe I speak for most fans of teams who sign $20 million a year caliber players when I say: OK, yeah, well, so what? The contract will not win any sabermetric deal of the year awards. I'm supposed to curl up in a ball and cry over that? Pennants are not given for efficiency. Wins and titles are how clubs are measured, and a move like this certainly seems preferable than signing a washed-up veteran and hoping for the best.
Baseball may be a team game, but it's a game of stars and personalities as well. As Phil Coke's Brain pointed out,the average family going to a baseball game doesn't know anything about sabermetrics, and they probably wouldn't recognize the greatness of the sabermetric all-stars. But you can be darn sure they know who Prince Fielder is.
And you know why? He plays daily (160+ games a year during his career, gets on base (3 consecutive seasons with an OBP of .400+), and most importantly, hits the ball really far, really often (.260 isolated power in 2009-11 is good for fifth in baseball during that period.) He's a guy pretty much everyone has heard of, and they're going to be excitedly talking about seeing him play. Sure, he's a bit fat, but looking at his career thus far he seems pretty durable, too.
Fielder's going to be the powerful left-handed batter the Tigers have never had -- I'm sorry but young versions of Carlos Pena and Curtis Granderson in Detroit do not count -- on the field, while being an instant fan favorite off the fielder. He's going to help the Tigers win a whole bunch of game over the next few years, help them when they get into the playoffs, sell jerseys, drive marketing and put additional butts in the seats. The fan buzz is already amazing.
Sabermetricians may -- and I'm not sure if they do -- try to claim all these numbers can be summed up nicely by saying each 1 WAR is worth $4.9 million a year, and that figure will raise with a minor inflation each year. I find that to be a highly simplified answer and a rather narrow view of the economic realities of the game.
In the end, it's a large deal, done by a team that is not afraid of large deals and one that does not like to play by the generally agreed upon rules of the pundits. Years from now, we'll have to see how the team chooses to act. It's already shown it can maneuver around as necessary. I mean, weren't the Tigers supposed to sell off all their players in 2009 when he bankrupt city and bankrupt team collapsed into a heap? I'm sorry it didn't work out for you that way, prognosticators.
Like it or not, the Central Divsion has a favorite for years to come -- and it's everyone's feel-good Royals.
As a fan of the baseball team that plays in Detroit, that suits me fine. As it does plenty of other Tigers fans -- and the team's owner -- too.
In the end, that's all the accounting that matters.
Source: Cot's Contracts, USA Today.
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I'm not going to lie. It's a risky deal.
But it gives us a good 5-6 years of Fielder in his prime before it gets scary. If he was 33, I’d be crying, but he’s 27 going on 28, its a good deal. I like the Jim Thome comparison.
Two Points on the Prince contract
1.) Is it really that historically bad? It seems many are having short memories regarding the Werth and Crawford contracts. Werth will make $20M or more from the age of 35-38…and he last year was a 2 win player. Carl Crawford is much of the same (a 0 win player last year) except his contract runs through the age of 35. You could also bring in the Alex Rodriguez contract and how he’s basically been a 3.5 win player for the past few years down to 2.5 last year and is still owed gobs of money until he is 41.
2.) WAR is practically irrelevant come playoff time. In fact, so are most statistics because the playoffs are such a statistical anomaly due to the small sample size. You need great players to carry you in the playoffs and Prince is a great player. Prince’s success will not be measured by statistics but by playoff success.
An example of this is Benoit. Did we overpay for Benoit? Yes. But in game 5 in Yankee Stadium when we needed a bullpen arm to come in for 1.2 innings of gut wrenching one-run baseball, he earned every single penny and I didn’t regret a dollar.
by nicolas08 on Jan 26, 2012 12:30 PM EST reply actions 6 recs
Same here. That's how you assign value to something, right there.
Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!
by Brand New Hero on Jan 26, 2012 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
Well, it's easy not to regret a single dollar
when it’s not your dollars :)
by TheCrestedHelm on Jan 26, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
Where do you think the Tigers get those dollars?
Out of thin air or from selling their product to the consumer i.e. fans of the game.
I'm not sure this deal would make anyone but a Tigers fan happy.
First is the unlikely hood that a major move would even be made by Detroit this offseason. We were also turned down by Oswalt and who knows for sure which other big name free agents also turned their back to a nice offer by Detroit. When Martinez went down many people got discouraged because he was the closest thing we had to an elite bat outside of Cabrera.
We can justify the overpay by saying it is both in the effort to chase down the first world series in Detroit nearly 30 years, and by Mike Illich’s age. If Fielder wins us a world series in the next 3-4 years, I don’t care if we have a .260/.350/.430 DH who makes 24 million per season 8 years from now.
prince
as a tiger fan here in boston i get to hear what people here think.it was disbelief the tigers pulled this off beacuse detroit isnt viewed as a big market but it is.yeah the royals and indians but mostly the royals are media darlings and i could care less!! as ive explained to people here why im so fired up about this upcoming year my reason is simple,i suffered through all that losing! i had to watch my team lose 119 games! so me and all tiger fans deserve to have OUR time in the sun again.so i make no apologies for beinf a tigers fan and evryone else making “fat boy” jokes is sour grapes!!
by tigerfaninboston on Jan 26, 2012 12:38 PM EST reply actions
lol.
you are very right about that! also prince will be on mlb networks hot stove tonight at 600 pm.
by tigerfaninboston on Jan 26, 2012 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
Rally Honey Badger?
Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!
by Brand New Hero on Jan 26, 2012 12:47 PM EST up reply actions
Before last week, Prince Fielder was an elite hitter and one of the leauges best
He signs with Detroit for a huge contract and now he’s all of a sudden a one-dimensional, overweight, Vernon Wells or something.
Are national writers just mad they have to take extra trips to Detroit now?
by Oberon on Jan 26, 2012 12:44 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
I dont know
I get the feeling they dislike the Tigers for the same reason most people dislike teams who spend a lot of money and win games with it, to be honest. If it’s your team, great! If it’s not your team, they’re bums.
by Kurt Mensching on Jan 26, 2012 12:49 PM EST up reply actions
You're right, sadly.
It would benefit the media on the national stages to keep their bias out of it. I have a hard time turning on ESPN or MLB Network and seeing someone huffing and puffing about how awful Prince Fielder is going to be. It’s very hypocritical.
That’s why I stick to BYB for my Tigers news. The analysis is fair, justified, and usually has some snarky humor to it. Keep it up guys.
Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!
by Brand New Hero on Jan 26, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Come for the analysis, stay for snark.
Methinks we’ve got a new tagline for up top.
I LIKE that tagline!
I'm owner/editor of The Wayne Fontes Experience a deputy editor at Bless You Boys, host the Bless You Boys Podcast and co-host The Knee Jerks podcast.
It's impossible to keep bias out of it
Try as you might, you may come close, but you can never fully eliminate it. It is an omnipresent issue and one which journalism has struggled to adjust to.
by TartanElk on Jan 26, 2012 1:11 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Agreed.
It is difficult, but ESPN is blatant about their “lack of” fair and non-biased reporting. I guess I just choose to skip over that channel these days.
Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!
by Brand New Hero on Jan 26, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions
ESPN is the worst.
I don’t have cable anymore, but if I did, I’d be interested to see the NBC Sports channel. Any word on how they are?
Haven't checked it out actually. I don't watch much TV during the "offseasons".
Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!
by Brand New Hero on Jan 26, 2012 1:21 PM EST up reply actions
And for some reason the "pundits" believe Detroit is a small market
They refuse to believe Detroit is anything more than a small market team, when it’s anything but. Detroit was still a top 10 media market at the start of the decade, and even after the sunbelt gains and rest belt exodus, I believe it’s around 11 or 12. The Tigers can handle a large contract or 3, especially if they win. Detroit should not be lumped with the Royals, Twins, Reds and Pirates of the world.
And isn’t Rob Neyer a Royals fan? Ah, it all starts to make sense now.
I'm owner/editor of The Wayne Fontes Experience a deputy editor at Bless You Boys, host the Bless You Boys Podcast and co-host The Knee Jerks podcast.
The MLB Network is generally very positive about the Tigers
They’re heaping praise on Iltich, DD, Leyland, Cabrera, Verlander, etc
Maybe it’s just an ESPN thing. Hey, they got their Boston vs New York matchup- in the Super Bowl. They should leave baseball to the winners.
"King of Minutiae"
by Tigerdog1 on Jan 26, 2012 1:04 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
mlb network
sadly,you are right.espn is biased.i watch mlb network for my updates and theyre analysis of players ase great.
by tigerfaninboston on Jan 26, 2012 2:57 PM EST up reply actions
I love MLB Network
They give every team their fair share of coverage…I love what they say about the Tigers, especially Billy Ripken and Dan Plesac. I also find Mitch Williams to be amusing.
In a Tiger fan's world, the Tigers go 162-0 and the White Sox go 0-162.
by Boeschlander on Jan 26, 2012 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
I dunno, Kurt
I didn’t see anywhere near this kind of reaction when the Angels went batshit crazy and signed Pujols and CJ Wilson to enormous contracts. Both of those are worse than Fielders, by the way, but I can’t recall seeing many articles pointing out how bad they were at the time.
why yes, I'm slightly drunk at the moment
by Mark in Chicago on Jan 26, 2012 4:02 PM EST up reply actions
I heard some on the radio about Pujols
but it was tempered by “AL Team= DH when he’s old” and “owner wants to sell tickets”.
If all sports fandom is a form of emotional gambling, football is poker and hockey is Russian roulette.
sure, I get that
But the same argument can be made for Fielder, which is part of the problem – the same standards aren’t applied to every team and there is a clear and obvious bias in the media towards the coasts. Pujols signed a longer contract for more money and he’s 5 years older than Prince. There’s no question in my mind that’s a worse deal, but nobody jumped on the Angels and Moreno like so many (not all) are jumping on Fielder and Ilitch.
why yes, I'm slightly drunk at the moment
by Mark in Chicago on Jan 26, 2012 4:08 PM EST up reply actions
And I haven't heard anyone whine about the Angels attempting to move Trumbo to 3B
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching
by David Tokarz on Jan 26, 2012 4:27 PM EST up reply actions
After they traded Napoli for Vernon Wells
I don’t think the critics waste their time with the Angels anymore. Everyone knows their crazy.
Exactly
If the Cubs or Rays got Fielder for 7 years / $175 Million, they’d be called the smartest run team ever. They’d be saying $25 Million a year is cheap for someone like Prince Fielder.
by Keith-Allen on Jan 26, 2012 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
They're just bitter...
…that they have to acknowledge that there are other MLB teams other than the Yankees, BoSaux, Angels, Phillies, and Dodgers.
(Un)Official President of the Team Jacob Turner Fan Club
Yet Another Movie Blog
by DetroitTigersGeek on Jan 26, 2012 12:53 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Inferiority complex?
I just wish everybody didn’t get their dander up when the team is criticized. These aren’t personal attacks on you or the City of Detroit. They are reasonable criticism of a contract. No body is out to get anybody. They are doing their jobs. ESPN doesn’t hate the Tigers and love the Red Sox. Rob Neyer isn’t lying in his columns because he used to live in Kansas.
Repeat: the criticism is reasonable, and similar to things said about the contracts of Albert Pujols, Alex Rodriguez, CC Sabathia, Joe Mauer, Jayson Werth, Ryan Howard, etc, etc.
Let the bats do the talking
When it became a fact that we got The Prince we became subject to praise and criticism. It’s just the way it is in the 24-hour media market. Let the players lace up their cletes, put their caps on their heads, grab their gloves, and run out of the dugout. The issue will be resolved on the field of play…..in about 68 days.
by Parrothead Mike on Jan 26, 2012 1:48 PM EST up reply actions
I think a better poll might be what would make this signing considered a good deal?
By that I mean, a world championship within 3 years? 3 WS appearances in the life of the contract? What exactly do we need to see out of the next 5-9 years where the contract is a winner? What if Prince hits .320 and 45 homers the next 5 years and we don’t make it into the series…does that mean it’s a bust?
Personally, if he is a solid contributor to one World Series championship…I say it’s a steal.
"i think it will be mostly feast the rest of the year,"
that's actually a separate post I have planned
this was originally supposed to be a 200 word post as part of a burning questions thing. Then it got longer and longer until it was in this present state.
by Kurt Mensching on Jan 26, 2012 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
Honestly if we win the World Series during the length of this contract
with or without a great performance from Fielder, will we care about anything but that sweet sweet championship ? So with that said, we are at the point where we measure our success by playoff success.
by nicolas08 on Jan 26, 2012 1:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
we're still talking about 84 and 68
and if we were old enough, the ones before that. So yeah. One title and it’s Detroit sports history forever
by Kurt Mensching on Jan 26, 2012 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Perennial Champions would be nice
It would be great to have a long-term reign in Detroit. It doesn’t happen often, but it’s something long-remembered everywhere.
by Parrothead Mike on Jan 26, 2012 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
Here's a question...
Regarding the criticism of Fielder’s hefty bodyweight, I’ve read some critics argue that players of such stature are often washed up by 32 or 33 years of age. If it were true that Fielder were to decline so quickly and actually retire at, for example, age 33…then wouldn’t that get the Tigers off of the last few years of the contract?
Anyhow, I hopeful that he will prove to have the necessary longevity to last the life of the contract. Considering that he is a vegetarien, it seems that he is already aware of the diet aspect of a healthy lifestyle. And at his young age (27) he still has some time to commit to training and actually become more fit over the upcoming years.
Could you imagine
since we’ve heard (and seen) that Miggy is getting into decent shape, could you imagine if he was able to convince Prince to lose a few pounds as well? Maybe the guy just needs a little motivation and help from teammates.
I Like Pie
from everything I've read
Prince has great energy and work ethic. He’s also a vegetarian, which should help keep the pounds down. Unless he’s sneaking in a few milkshakes every day, he could be dealing with something genetic and no amount of diet/exercise regimen is going to cause him to drop the weight.
What I think Prince MIGHT have going for him is that he’s very athletic for a big guy. Players like Mo Vaughan, David Ortiz (who had a decent season) and Adam Dunn (haha White Sox) are all the slow lumbering types. Fielder is not, he’s like a freakishly athletic d-linemen in the NFL like Shaun Rogers and Warren Sapp that are big guys and look fat, but they can perform at a high level for longer than people expect. I hope that’s the case with Prince, anyway.
why yes, I'm slightly drunk at the moment
by Mark in Chicago on Jan 26, 2012 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
He's not a vegetarian
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching
by David Tokarz on Jan 26, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions
See, I thought that too
But anything I’ve read says he just cut out meat and fish.
This is why we need Kurt at these press conferences
To ask the hard-hitting questions that fans want to know.
how did this fit under the salary cap??
by Kurt Mensching on Jan 26, 2012 5:51 PM EST up reply actions
Who wears bigger pants?
Prince or Cecil?
by Rob Rogacki on Jan 26, 2012 7:02 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The Venn diagram still say's he's a vegetarian

All vegans are vegetarians
Not all vegetarians are vegans
I sometimes eat onions on my hamburgers
The other sports are just sports. Baseball is a love. ~Bryant Gumbel, 1981
by momotigers on Jan 26, 2012 5:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I was a vegan for a month before I became a vegetarian for 4 years
Cheese, man. Cheese.
I know how the whole vegetarian/vegan thing works
But there is still a difference. Just trying to clarify for all parties involved.
I do not enjoy onions on my hamburgers, but I will not eat a coney without onions on top.
by Rob Rogacki on Jan 26, 2012 5:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
No he's not
John Niyo via Twitter: Prince Fielder is NOT a vegetarian. “Let’s shoot that down right now,” he laughed. Said he was, but it lasted all of about three months.
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching
by David Tokarz on Jan 26, 2012 5:54 PM EST up reply actions
That's cool
Hearing that he was a vegan inspired me to be a vegan too, but that only lasted 2 hours. Just finished eating half of a chicken.
by Keith-Allen on Jan 26, 2012 9:12 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
my bad
I knew he was a vegan and for some reason typed vegetarian. I don’t think it negates the argument, tho.
why yes, I'm slightly drunk at the moment
by Mark in Chicago on Jan 26, 2012 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
Horrific contract
Terrible misuse of resources, give your average sabr guy 216 mil to spend on 4 or 5 guys & det. Would be twelve wins better today wo Fielder…but I guess this is not the point… Dombrowskis job must be hairpulling @ times when Mr. Illitch does things like this…looks like a 12 year old building a fantasy team in an action draft whos outta money after bidding on three players, As a business decision this is just plum dumb batshit insane…however the fan side of me will sit back and enjoy watching them play all summer..
by Wolverine119 on Jan 26, 2012 1:54 PM EST via mobile reply actions
After the first period, you can actually stop hitting the "." key.
by lesmanalim on Jan 26, 2012 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well played.
Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Drink, and Fight!
by Brand New Hero on Jan 26, 2012 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
Um... no
There’s value in roster spots too. Signing CJ Wilson and Jose Reyes might have improved the team by more, but they’ll take up more space on the roster.
"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz
"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching
by David Tokarz on Jan 26, 2012 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
Why stop at 4 or 5
we should have signed 10, 1 WAR players, to 1 year, $2 million deals, in each of the the next 10 years….that would that would be 20 wins per year for less than we are paying Prince, WOW, ZOMG, OMG!!!
Hahaha
Nice.
"I believe in a good kick in the ass. This— I believe. " -- Walker Percy
I tweet about stuff sometimes @jackhitts.
You argue that:
“Fielder fits in roughly with Albert Pujols, Ryan Howard, Adrian Gonzalez and Joe Mauer in annual compensation and the length of the deal. Sure he’s maybe a million higher a year, but I hardly find that to be a reason to freak out. On a shorter deals, you can add in names like Miguel Cabrera or Mark Teixeira. "
However Howard has declined in 2 straight years and hasn’t even started the new contract you’re comparing Fielder too. Mauer is injured and might not play C again, and Tex is already declining 2 years into the deal.
So even though you’re telling people not to freak out, half of those deals were horrible within 2 years of being signed.
Pujols has declined in 3 straight years but I can’t judge it yet till he plays. And Adrian makes $60M less than Fielder so he’s not really comparable.
The only comparable that works is Cabrera and he was 25 when they signed and will be 32 when the deal is over, and that’s not a good match for Fielder given he’ll be 28 at the start and in his mid to late 30s when it’s done.
I know it’s not your intention, but comparing Fielder to Howard/Tex/Mauer is actually hurting, and not helping your argument.
probably question #2 or #3, but
the meme that kills me is “think of what the tigers could have done with that money?”. OK, what could they have done? “signed Jose Reyes and Mark Buehrle and Roy Oswalt” really? i don’t subscribe to the nonsense theory that players don’t want to play in Detroit or that we have to overpay to get players, etc – yet, we also have to understand that not every player will sign with us. overpay or not, reyes wasn’t coming here. Buehrle wasn’t either. and oswalt pretty much said directly that. Free agents are free – they have some say in where they end up.
“oh yeah, well, now the Tigers are out of the expensive free agent market for the next decade”. no, no they are not. plus, what would make you think Cole Hamels will sign with us? Or Zack Grienke or Liriano?
Consider: how did we sign Pudge, Maggs, Damon? in addition to all being Boras clients, they were supposedly out of options. This is our pattern.
Love this sneaky pick up
cuz im a tiger fan thats lived in ohio my whole life and the indians fans are crying on the radio"we have no chance now" and thats how you know it was a great move when your rival knows there doomed for the next 9 years…plus my 3 year old son will be able to enjoy seeing a Fielder hit home run just as i did, as a kid growing to love the tigers.
by Tettleton Fan 20 on Jan 26, 2012 3:46 PM EST reply actions

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