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Third base solution?

Let's do a little prospect watching and rosterbation. I'm going to consider the cases of two top prospects.

Mr. 2007 is a 3B, drafted in the 1st Round (12th overall) of the 2007 draft as a high school graduate. He played a short stint in rookie ball during his draft year, but essentially, his first full season was the next year, where he played A-ball. Here's his line as an 18-year old kid in A-ball:

2008 (A ball): 345AB, 102H, 16 2B, 18 HR, .296 / .354 / .499 AVG/OBP/SLG

Three years later, Mr. 2010 is a 3B, drafted in the supplemental round (44th) overall of the 2010 draft as a high school graduate. Same story: He played a short stint in rookie ball during his draft year, but essentially, his first full season was the next year, where he played A-ball. Here's his line as a 19-year old kid in A-ball

2011 (A ball): 562AB, 158H, 36 2B, 7 HR, .312 / .367 / .436 AVG/OBP/SLG

The stories are very similar and the stat lines tell a similar story as well. Both players had good showings in their first full professional season. Mr. 2007 exhibited more HR power while most of Mr. 2010's extra base hits were doubles. Other than that, most of the other stats comp pretty well; good average with a little on-base ability to complement the average. Defensively, Mr. 2007 has historically been evaluated as a strong defensive player at 3B. Mr. 2010 is adequate defensively at 3B, but some scouts have theorized that he may ultimately move to the OF in the majors.

Let's look at the time frame. With very similar stories and stats, we essentially have two versions of the same player. Essentially, Mr. 2007 is Mr. 2010's ghost of baseball future. Maybe Mr. 2010 can look at Mr. 2007 and see what will come about if things go unchanged? Well, we can look at how Mr. 2007 has done; he probably hasn't developed quite as well as his parent club had hoped. His 2008 season is listed above. Here's the next three:

2009 (A+ / AA): 478AB, 118H, 32 2B, 13 HR, .247 / .325 / .400
2010 (AA): 504AB, 34 2B, 14 HR, .252, / .333 / .411
2011 (AA, AAA) 358AB, 89H, 18 2B, 12 HR, .249 / .309 / .405

Mr. 2007 has had some injury issues, but has essentially turned into a .250 / .325 / .400 sort of guy as he's advanced with a fairly systematic progression. He's headed into his age 22 season as a former top prospect who's still got a strong defensive reputation and still hits for decent power, but his average and (consequentially) OBP have dipped at the higher levels. The tools that got him drafted as a 12th overall pick are still there, but that low average has taken some of his shine off. He's pretty close to MLB ready.

In the Tiger's organization, I think he'd be a favorite to take over the job sometime in 2012. As fans, we'd be ready to hand him the job since even a .250 / .325 / .400 line with good defense is better than we're expecting out of Inge/Kelly. We'd assume that even if he didn't hit for a big average in 2012, he's certainly young enough to improve and the tools are all there. Given four or five years of team control, we'd be settled at 3B for a while.

Mr. 2007 is Matt Dominguez of the Miami Marlins, who have a new (sort of) 3B named Hanley Ramirez locked up for the next three seasons. Mr. 2010 is obviously Nick Castellanos. I bet the Marlins would love to have Castellanos, with an ETA of 2015 instead of Dominguez, who's now taking up a 40-man roster spot with nowhere to go. As for 2012 and 2013, I bet the Tigers parent club would rather have Dominguez, the older and more-ready version of Castellanos.

I know as fans, we have high hopes for our prospects, Castellanos in particular. During his first professional season, he did nothing to disappoint us except strike out a bit much (which we all assume will improve) and not hit for much power (which we all say will come when he fills out). I'm sure that many of us have visions of a player in 2015 that will be better than this 2012 projection of Matt Dominguez, but it's a swap I'd consider making 1-for-1. There's a chance that Castellanos could develop exactly as Dominguez has, where part of his game falls off instead of improves. There's a lot of development between Nick Castellanos and the majors. There's always a good chance of a roadblock when the path to the majors is so long. I love Castellanos, but I think I'd make the swap. Perhaps I'll get butchered, but what does everyone think?



This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of the Bless You Boys writing staff.

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Keith law just said on Miami radio dominguez might be the best defensive 3rd baseman in the minors and the best defensive prep he has ever seen. Kid can’t hit off speed pitching at all and if he can’t do it in the minors after 4 years i doubt it just gonna eventually click for him. I would be extremely disappointed if the tigers gave up anything significant for what will most likely be a defensive utility guy

by syper17 on Jan 6, 2012 2:46 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions  

I'll pass

not a bad idea, but I think Castellanos ends up being better than Dominguez… just my opinion.

No longer the Founder, President and CEO of the Ryan Raburn Fan Club

by tigers22 on Jan 6, 2012 7:10 PM EST reply actions  

It's a huge undersell at this point in time.

Castellanos has youth and upside that Dominguez no longer has. It’s possible he develops similarly to Dominguez, but until then, his trade worth should be evaluated as a potential All-Star rather than a potential 6-7 hitter.

by lesmanalim on Jan 6, 2012 7:22 PM EST reply actions  

yup

Especially considering Dominguez sounds a hell of a lot like Brandon Inge 2.0 to me right now.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

Contributor, Bless You Boys

by David Tokarz on Jan 7, 2012 2:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Sickels calls him Pedro Feliz

Link

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

Contributor, Bless You Boys

by David Tokarz on Jan 7, 2012 2:07 AM EST up reply actions  

Don't say that too loud

For some reason people love Inge.
We’ll have to trade down and get him then.

by Keith-Allen on Jan 7, 2012 10:55 AM EST up reply actions  

Again

I’d love Dominguez. But not for Castellanos.

"You, on the other hand, make Eeyore look like Rainbow Brite." -johnmoz

"I think of you more as the blue book style essay of sports journalism."-Kurt Mensching

Contributor, Bless You Boys

by David Tokarz on Jan 7, 2012 2:51 PM EST up reply actions  

"Perhaps I'll get butchered"

You nailed it there. Castellanos might not be the big power hitter that some projected, but I think he could be a tremendous hitter, much like Derek Jeter. That’s what I see.

Another guy to think about The NY Yankees’ 3B prospect, that’s being road blocked by Alex Rodriguez.

Brandon Laird. Gerald Laird’s little brother. We could have B$ and G$ in the same line-up! :-) 3B would suck even more though.

by Keith-Allen on Jan 6, 2012 9:28 PM EST reply actions  

Speaking of 3B...O's Fans want Inge

From: Baltimore Orioles SB Nation Camden Chat on 12/16/11
http://www.camdenchat.com/2011/12/16/2640357/29-trades-for-29-teams-detroit-tigers

Trade:

Mark Reynolds & Jeremy Guthrie
for
Brandon Inge, Aaron Westlake, Brian Flynn and Brenny Paulino

Two MLB-ready starters for three C+ prospects with upside and a bad contract (Inge).

Hey O’s why not swap 2B’s Brian Roberts for Ryan Raburn while were at it.

Better yet let’s broker a 3-team trade with Baltimore and Atanta so…

Detroit gets Prado
Atlanta gets Adam Jones
Baltimore gets Delmon Young and lots of prospects

by Boomer Dog on Jan 7, 2012 1:37 PM EST reply actions  

God, I do not want Mark Reynolds

I’d rather have Inge and Kelly at 3B. I’d rather play with 8 guys on the field than have Mark Reynolds. He is a black hole that eats black holes for breakfast. He is one of the main reasons why I do not like using OBP, wOBA, or WAR.

There are some that would gut our entire system to win now, but I’m definitely not one of them. We got some very nice prospects in the lower levels, like Paulino, Burgos, Collins, Gibson, ect, but we can’t be trading them until they have reached their maximum trade value. That’s a few years from now. I like Brenny Paulino alot, we even have his brother David, who might be pretty good too. Also Brian Flynn can’t be traded yet because he was just drafted in 2011.

by Keith-Allen on Jan 7, 2012 2:48 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree...not to gut the farm system

Thought it was interesting fans of another team would offer 2 Major League players for Inge and lower level prospects.

I would not like to gut the farm system but also realize the Tigers have a unique opportunity to win in the next 3 years or so given the current roster and the age / willingness of the owner.

Therefore, would still like to address a better solution for 3B and 2B and upgrade the team speed / defense at the expense of Delmon Young and reasonable prospect requests outside of Turner and Castellanos.

Any short-term solution at 3B prior to opening day would help…

- Figgins for D Young
- Angels back-ups (Izturis / Aybar /Callaspo) particularly after just signing Cantu
- Cardinals back-ups ( Carpenter / Cox)

by Boomer Dog on Jan 7, 2012 3:28 PM EST up reply actions  

How is the next 3 years any more unique than the last 3 years?

Or the next 3 years after the next 3 years? I want a perennial contender that is built to last forever, not just 3 years.

by Keith-Allen on Jan 7, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions  

3 reasons to win now...

1. age / willingness of owner,

2. utility / contracts of core players: Cabrera / Martinez / Verlander / Valverde / etc,

3. style of play change – additional inter-league games

Is it worth waiting 2-3 years for prospects to play / have trade value?

Current team needs to address the weakness at: 3B / 2B / LF

Top of the Order Batters: Average / OBP / Speed

Team Speed / Team Defense

by Boomer Dog on Jan 7, 2012 5:08 PM EST up reply actions  

We'll win, without comprimising our future

What we really needed was a back-up catcher so that Avila doesn’t burn out again.
We needed a bridge to Benoit and Valverde, if the starting pitcher couldn’t go 7 innings.
We needed some healthy corner outfielders.

We already fixed 3 those problems.
We got Laird. We got Dotel. We’ll have Young for a full-year and Boesch should be 100% come Spring Training.

It seems like people are inventing problems that don’t really exist. We’ll be good in LF and 2B offensively. There’s much to be desired defensively though. At 3B we’re weak offensively, but at least Inge/Kelly can field the position adequately. We’ll survive with a Inge/Kelly platoon until mid-season or the trade deadline. There’s really nothing we can do at 3B right now, but wait to see how things play out. At 3B, our division rivals have Danny Valencia, Jack Hannahan, Brent Morel, and Mike Moustakas. It’s comforting to know that everyone else in our division shares that same weakness at 3B.

by Keith-Allen on Jan 7, 2012 7:06 PM EST up reply actions  

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